AllBetter

Breaking Barriers in Education and Recovery

• Joe Van Wie • Season 4 • Episode 86

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What does it take to rebuild your life from the depths of addiction to academic and personal success? Jamie Monahan, a recruiter and certified recovery specialist at Luzerne County Community College's All One Recovery Center, shares his extraordinary journey of resilience and determination. His story highlights the pivotal moments that led him to seek help and his unwavering commitment to maintaining recovery. Jamie's firsthand experience underscores the transformative power of support systems, illustrating how the right help at the right time can make all the difference.

You'll be captivated by the stories of triumph over adversity as we spotlight educational programs that change lives, like the All One Recovery Educational Institute. From earning business degrees to gaining acceptance into prestigious programs, we hear about individuals who have overcome significant obstacles thanks to the support from organizations and key figures such as Melissa Wassel. This episode paints a vivid picture of how education and community support are vital in rebuilding lives, offering hope and second chances to those in recovery.

We also explore the importance of creating supportive environments for students in recovery, from addressing cultural shame to providing resources that remove barriers to education. Celebrating achievements like acceptance into Penn State, we delve into the multifaceted support systems in place, including the KEYS program. Through personal anecdotes and practical advice, this episode encourages listeners to reduce stigma and extend a helping hand, ensuring that no one has to climb the mountain of recovery alone.

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https://www.luzernecounty.org/Do

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Speaker 1:

Hello and thanks again for listening to another episode of All Better. I'm your host, joe Van Lee. Today's guest is Jamie Monahan. Jamie works at Luzerne County Community College at the All One Recovery Center. Jamie's job is a recruiter and a peer mentor and a CRS that's going to be certified recovery specialist for the new student body. This program is designed for people in recovery early long-term recovery to return to higher education. We're going to discuss that today and how unique this program is and their continual support for the census and our residents and friends at Fellowship House who are now entering the program. We also discuss a little of Jamie's history, entry into recovery and what recovery means to him. Today I look forward to meeting my friend Jamie Monahan. Yo, we're here with G Money, jamie Monahan. Jamie, thanks for coming on. It's great to see you.

Speaker 2:

Joe, thank you. It's a pleasure to be here and I'm excited to get started.

Speaker 1:

We have a lot to talk about. We've been keeping in touch the last couple of years because we share a common condition here. Now it's recovery. You know, some years ago it was addiction, and what you've done over the last three years and every time you reached out to me I'm going to tell you straightforward was it has been an inspiration and an encouragement to me to see you not get destroyed by addiction, depression or any other kind of negative feelings that come with that, and to and to watch the people's lives you've impacted that many people may not know about. That's in our field. It was very inspiring to watch. So I wanted to not only discuss that how you entered recovery. We have a lot to talk about of what you're currently doing in your role now, which is, I think, the most interesting thing happening for anyone who's entering early recovery options they can have now. So how would you summarize what addiction, what need was it meeting? That maybe you weren't aware of initially, but you came to find out that the addiction was more than just drug use.

Speaker 2:

Well, there's a lot to it, you know. Born on the streets of Scranton, I think all roads lead back there and we do have a connection in addiction and in recovery. But now, helping others succeed. And for me, I put my head down, since I was 15 years old and drank and started using drugs at the age of 18. After, you know, I earned a football scholarship and thought I was invincible until I lost everything. And for me, addiction has so many meanings. Addiction has so many meanings and to look back at my life, what it was, I think I needed to go through what I went through to get where I'm going after today. Addiction took over my life as we may know it and with mental health, depression. You know there's a lot that took over, but humiliation was number one. And when I finally raised my hand and asked for help, this is the first time in my life that I wanted to go get help.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, it's. It's strange that the worst day of your life if you can obtain long-term recovery, it becomes a celebration. The rest of your life, the most desperate day and I think people who are new to say, an AA or an NA community go and see a celebration. Right, I'm celebrating five years. The room tends to forget this was the worst day of my life. Now here's a cake.

Speaker 2:

So cake and some coffee. But you know what too, when I travel now and speak on college campuses or speak at treatment centers, everyone likes to talk about the worst day, but I like to talk about the first day. Let's start climbing back up that mountain Because at the end of the day, we're setting ourselves back up right. When I decided to go to treatment at the end of 2020, I wanted to run. I wanted to get in my car and drive and drive and drive, or I didn't want to go on any further, and that was tough for me because that would have been the easy way out to give up. That was tough for me because that would have been the easy way out to give up and to put my head down and say you know what? I'm going to listen to every suggestion that comes my way. I'm done running my life because I just ran it into the ground for the past 25 years, but listening to other suggestions from people.

Speaker 2:

And you know what? I didn't have insurance at the time and Lackawanna County Drug and Alcohol called me and said we have a bed open for you. I didn't care what door it was, I was taking it, and when I took it, I said, it doesn't matter what room we sit in. These four walls could be as magical as we want to. They could be the worst room I've ever been in, but how do we succeed from here? And it was a learning experience. And you know, I spent 71 days in a treatment center 71 days almost a quarter of a year. And you know what? They wanted me to go for 22 to 28 days and I just used for 25 years. Yeah, what's 22 days going to do to help me for the rest of my life, after I just used for 25 years? It clearly wasn't enough time. So I gave myself more time and I wanted to stay when I was leaving because I was comfortable. Yeah, Safe.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, that's a. That's a struggle on the other end. So a clinician, um, seeing someone who does really well, sometimes they could stay too long and they rely a lot on the provider because it is a special place and I don't know if you relate to this, but maybe after 25 years this is the first place where you connected with people emotionally. We didn't have to, like in Scranton, make these distinctions why people are different, why I'm better than in group out group that you could connect with anyone that was kind of sitting in the room in a group, especially after 70 days, how deeply were you connected with people?

Speaker 2:

well, when I first walked in there funny quick story I went to a group and I raised my hand and said hi, I'm, I'm Jamie and I'm an alcoholic and drug addict. And half the room started laughing at me and you know, I took a step back, thinking you know I'm not supposed to be here. And some of the guys like that's not true, you're one of the employees here. And I said no, I need to be here. And within two weeks from my efforts, of my own recovery, I became a community leader.

Speaker 2:

So I ran 25 guys for about almost three months, getting them out of their beds for breakfast, their meds. Let's go, let's get to groups, let's start programming. And you know what too and I heard all these statistics and it's tough If you're sitting in a room of 50 guys, two are going to make it. And at that point I told the guys that didn't want to be there move out of my way, because I need to go get this, my life is over and I need to create a future for myself. So everything I was doing, from the walk and the talk, was totally different from when I first went to treatment when I was 26 years old, and I did 28 days in Marworth and three months later I was drinking again. Yeah.

Speaker 1:

What do you think was different with? You described it just earlier that there was this moment and a lot of people always describe it, but it's when it's happening to me. Or, like you just described yourself how profound it is to say what giving up means Sometimes that doesn't connect with people intellectually. Giving up what letting someone take over my mind and stuff and you're letting someone that cares about you you might not see it at first. You're that act of humility and trust is what you could call a spiritual awakening.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, and you know, from day one, when I met my counselor or treatment she, she started telling me what can be better in my life if I just listen to her, and I said I'm all yours. But before I decided to go to treatment, it was a lot. My world crashed down in December of 2020, running from the law, Nowhere to go. I was unhirable. I just had a horrible, horrible relationship and I blamed all the outside factors on my usage. And when I went to treatment, I looked at myself in the mirror. I was afraid and I said to myself you did all this. Now it's what you do from here that's going to define you for the rest of your life. You know we're going to have the judgments and the stigma, and I believe stigma it's a national pandemic right now and it's hard to break that. And you and your team, everything you're doing for your clients here like I see all that on social media I didn't have that right.

Speaker 2:

I didn't have the. Let's get together as a community. Let's go out to a movie together. So they're not just living rehab life, they're living life in recovery before they go back to their communities. Yeah, they don't have to hide, they don't. And you know what, too? Coming into recovery and sobriety, I felt like myself again. I didn't have to hide or wear millions of masks, you know, and that helped, because I felt accepted into that room from people that didn't even know me.

Speaker 1:

We were just talking about that this morning the exhaustion of mask, and it comes from Latin persona, which means mask. So person means mask, so a person is an actor. We only meet the actor and the internal life could have been so tormentive, for for many of us that addiction just arrives as a solution. Right, and to hear you say that and watch guys really have high motivation in the beginning, but their ego starts doing some of the work for them. The egos can be healthy. It's there to defend you, but it's been exhausted. It was working. My ego started kindergarten. It was working overtime. I don't have a personality, but I'm not going to let anyone hurt me.

Speaker 2:

Mine was doing pushups in grade school. And when I when you know, I was gifted athletically, so when I was playing sports, that took over and you were really good at sports.

Speaker 1:

There comes a status and a position with that that will lead to a great identity.

Speaker 2:

There's positives to it and especially in this area too, we're high on sports and coming back to the community, losing a football scholarship and have to go back into the community with my head down, and you know what? My head's been low for years and this past three and a half years I'm coming up. God willing, I'm coming up on four years sobriety, december 6th, and it's the most time I've had since I was 15 years old. Congrats, continuous sobriety and I just met an amazing, amazing girl this year and just the gifts that come into your life when you start telling the truth, when you start doing the right things right. And a big key to my success today is three and a half years out of treatment.

Speaker 2:

I still do my hour of counseling a week and my therapy. So I do two hours a week in therapy and counseling with drug and alcohol and my mental health. That'll never change. You know. You know how we are. We were in the same program at school and we take on a lot. You know, and I tried to. I try to block all of it out with taking five classes or getting involved on campus until I said you know what. I need to be okay with myself. I need to get that healthy balance and it's okay to go to treatment. Still, yeah, you know, guys think they need to come out and within six months I'm good, I'm going back into society, which they get swallowed up again.

Speaker 1:

It's just looking at the history should say Alcoholics Anonymous an easy one to point to. We have. There's this founder, bill Wilson, who writes a book, becomes prolific, and then there's this huge gap in time. If you don't read the history of AA, he gets away from the consequences of addiction in a very dramatic way and remains away from them. What he does not remain away from the consequences of addiction in a very dramatic way and remains away from them. What he does not remain away from is depression, unhealthy relationships, infidelity with his wife, misappropriations with what he was going to design for AA.

Speaker 1:

He gets restrained by the community and he says he achieves emotional sobriety 25 years later you just described you caught on to that early and so did I because I got married and I can get away from the consequences of an addiction from cocaine drinking just completely. I just couldn't handle any of them. Daily basic things just collapse on me. That goes away in early sobriety. What does not go away and what I don't have naturally just by not drinking, is emotional resiliency, stress, tolerance, making intimacy coming easy because of you know just my perspective. So therapy I'm glad you mentioned that and most people should be really open to that after an initial sobriety, because it's add nothing but more fulfillment to my life and the people around me.

Speaker 2:

And you're totally right. You hit it all by saying it was tough to me to get back into a relationship. Now that I'm sober this is the first time I've been into a sober relationship how am I going to react? How's my, my mental health going to? Is it going to take over? And um, these were all the ideas going through my head when I just slowed down, took a step back and I was honest and her and I sat down and talked and said this is who you're getting. That's awesome Right.

Speaker 2:

And today I'm totally different. I sat down and talked and said this is who you're getting. That's awesome Right. And today I'm totally different than I was, and physically and mentally, because I went into treatment at 170. Today I'm 210 pounds, but I feel good. I feel good and I have cookies here too, so we can celebrate. We're good with those. But I was talking to a couple of close friends and support the other day saying what did 2024 bring for you? And I said here's what it brought for me. You know, it gave me my my business associates degree at LCC. I met a girl, I got a full time position on campus with benefits, and I just got accepted two weeks ago to the Penn State Online World Campus Business Program that I'm starting as a junior in the spring.

Speaker 2:

And you know what, three years ago last week I walked on that campus homeless. I had nowhere to live. And you know what? I was afraid to go back to my family in Dunmore because I thought I exhausted all those avenues. Yeah, my father just celebrated 33 years of sobriety. He's a graduate of Marworth of 1992. And I remember being 12 going to visit him there. Yeah, you know, now him and I go together and we speak at those events. Oh, that's wild, which it brings us closer. And you know, I'm doing some outdoor things. Like, he just bought two kayaks. We're going to take them out in the water. But you know what? I'm not spending time in front of a drink or drug for 17 hours a day. Yeah, you know, so there's. I try to think about where I was, what I was thinking and where I'm at today, and it's totally different.

Speaker 1:

That's a great transition to what I want to talk about, this new position that you have. We can't talk about it enough because there's very few things that I there's no program like it. So Luzerne County Community College, its main campus in Nanticoke and its satellite campus, which many of our residents are now signing up to, the Steamtown and online classes and this is a variation of any classes, from philosophy, bio, nursing, technical skills, liberal arts, you name it requirements 60 credits to an associate degree. Maybe I'm speaking too much, but there is a program that allows people in recovery to experience 60 credits with a recovery grant all one recovery. Did I butcher that?

Speaker 2:

No, that was spot on and you know. You know too. I walked out of treatment march of 21 and someone in recovery said did you ever hear about the area program at lcc? I said no, what is it? They said look it up, go find up.

Speaker 2:

So I walked on campus and and I met with director she's amazing Melissa Wassel, yeah, melissa, from day one, had my back, and what I mean by that is I was afraid of walking in there, thinking I can't get financial aid. There could be loans out there. I'm not smart enough to go back to school. I burned my bridges at East Stroudsburg University. She said stop worrying about all that, let's take it one step at a time. So her staff around me helped me get into school.

Speaker 2:

And when I tell you get into school, yeah, people see, if you do what you're told, your education could be paid for. But to maintain a 2.0 or higher, two check-ins a month, that seems like basic to me. And my first semester I was a three eight. I didn't think I was smart enough until I see the letter in the mail that I got the Dean's list and I'm like it's not just acing your classes and let me tell you about this program.

Speaker 2:

So the all one recovery educational Institute gave me an opportunity, not just a second chance in my education, but a second chance at life, to build a future for myself. And it's bigger than me, like we think. All right, so the individual succeeding after graduation. These programs are giving us a life, a family, you know, after we're done and look at you here running this for for guys I can't even walk in life Right, and myself I saw this come to fruition a few months back. So my last semester I graduated May 23rd and when I walked across the arena stage it was awesome and I'd been waiting for 20 years to do that. And, um, looking back, I was the work study in the recovery office for a year and a half.

Speaker 2:

So, I basically sat with students. You know what works for you, what doesn't work for you, how are these classes? And I went to Melissa and I said, melissa, there is an opening here for a certified recovery specialist. I like to throw my hat in the ring. I'm not certified yet, so I did my research. All the Scranton classes were booked, so I had a drive for 11 Saturdays in a row, from March to May, down to the Reading Area Community College Wow, and I put the time in. And this was also with six classes, 18 credits, business classes to graduate, along with doing a collegiate business plan competition that I had to get into.

Speaker 2:

That just ended in May as well. So when I came back, I did the 77 hours, I passed the PA cert board test and the job was offered me two months later. Congratulations. And to this week was my starting.

Speaker 1:

My fifth week and I've been chasing you for two months to come on the podcast to talk about this. You know disclosure and, for the sake of the conversation, I was in the same same boat and we did not know this yet. And if I, if I'm telling this right, this is how I remember it. I make a plan for fellowship house. Other people buy into the plan. It can work. I never thought I'd work in treatment. I'm done with advertising. I am cooked. I don't want any pretense to my life. I felt like the only space, professionally and personally, was this authenticity of recovery and this kind of vocation rising to me, to the only currency left in my life is to help people get out of their own pain. Like I really felt, like I had a second chance at life. So I left school at the university of Scranton um 2001 might've been junior philosophy, started a business. I am unemployable. This is why I'm a filmmaker.

Speaker 2:

We can put our mask back on.

Speaker 1:

Oh yeah, just, totally just. The unconventional life is where I'm normal. I am not a square. Every time I tried to be a square, life got horrifying for me. My addiction would come out.

Speaker 1:

So I go back to school, I do the CRS class. This is four years ago now. In the middle of the CRS class they explain the Zern RE program. I never considered it. I thought I would still start Fellowship House, hire clinicians and just be like.

Speaker 1:

You know the guy there and this gentleman talked me into it. He said why don't you? You know you got all these degrees or classes. We'll take them over to Luzerne. Why don't you get all these requirements done? You should really study psych and human services. I said human services.

Speaker 1:

I have fixed ideas in my head that don't make sense. I take a human services class. He talks me into it. I sign up. I'm thinking how am I doing this? I got a kid on the way. I'm strapped, I'm bootheeled with cash. I can't. You know, I'm working in a treatment center First night in the class. Who do I see? I swear to God you were in that class and we were in a support group together and I just breath. I could breathe a sigh of relief Like this is what I'm doing, like I'm. I'm improving my life, I'm getting the life I want. Um, I have the enough humility and the arrogance is knocked out of me that I can now learn it away. That was very difficult in my 20s in these settings, because of just how much noise was always in my head. Did you have the noise? Was it a different experience? The first couple of classes, the easing- it was.

Speaker 2:

And you know what too. I remember that night and when I walked in and saw you, I saw a familiar face, yeah, and all the worry and the anxiety went out the window because you said, james, everything's going to be okay. And it's hard because you go into rooms when you don't know anybody, even when you're celebrating, getting your chips and stuff like that. But to see you coming from the same streets as me back in the day, I knew there was a different way. Right, there's a better way, and it helped me get through my first semester, yeah.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, same. Here it was reciprocated, so I just finished myself undergrad.

Speaker 2:

Congratulations At.

Speaker 1:

SUNY for psych, and then I'll start an MSW program in January.

Speaker 2:

I'm going to be picking your brain because I'm going fully online now too.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I loved online for me, the experience. I think I excel better at online modules because I don't have the noise and sensory of being in a room with a bunch of people trying to figure out what their stories are.

Speaker 2:

My mind's just fucking it's working all the time, which is good Cats in there, man. But um, no, it's, uh it's. I'm still waiting to wake up from a dream. Yeah Right, this is too good to be true for me. And the the support that I get from my family and and you know, my older brother and sister love them to death and just by the text messages you're killing it. Keep doing what you're doing. And you know, when I walked out of that treatment for 71 days, I wasn't looking for the pat on the back.

Speaker 2:

This time People go to rehab and think, all right, I just did my time, you need to be back in my life, and I had to put the work in just to get my family back, and then the community.

Speaker 2:

And then I meet a beautiful woman that just changed my life this year and she's so supportive. Quick story, and she's going to probably get mad at me, but she showed up in my place not too long ago, like about two months ago, with a gift for me and it's the small things, right. And I opened it up and these are covers for my sobriety chips. Oh cool, she's not even in sobriety, yeah, and for her to care and support my chips, like that took me to a whole nother level, meaning from day one she's been listening to me and it's helping me open up even more and now to succeed to the path that I'm going on this fall and all next year. Funny thing is, I'm a huge Notre Dame football fan and I had to put all my Irish gear away and pull out the Penn state stuff because I'm going to be a Penn state student.

Speaker 2:

Now you have to right.

Speaker 1:

New life, man Rebirth.

Speaker 2:

You get to live two lives now too, right, new life, man Rebirth. You get to live two lives now, right, and but walking into LCC, I work every day now, which is something I love to do, right, and I work. Jim Ezekiel, she is the, she's the airy academic facilitator, so she meets with the students on the academic side of it and I'll meet with them on the recovery side of it and we kind of split it up for them and make it easier for them. You know, she makes sure that they're taking the right classes, they're not taking too many classes, their academic balance is there for them. And then I I work with their support and recovery for the whole semester.

Speaker 2:

And recovery plans kind of chart on that and you know I talked to them too, saying that we have a lot of relationships with a lot of agencies out there in the communities and if you need help with X, we're here to help you. If you come to us and say there's a barrier in my way, we'll sit down and figure out what community agency can help you with that barrier so you can continue your education and some of that's is that kind of roll into the idea of the KEYS program.

Speaker 1:

That's Keystone Education Guild Success and it's a program for parents.

Speaker 2:

Is that a resource? No, it's a pro. Well, yes, for parents, for single parents, but it's for anybody that have barriers in their way, which is food insecurities.

Speaker 2:

And you can help them get the resources for, say, SNAP benefits, food stamps, and then these barriers could slowly be removed so college could keep happening at the pace that's right for them Exactly, so they don't have to worry about I need a bus pass or I don't have gas to get to my classes, which the keys program will help them put that in place. So they're reimbursed all that, which is awesome.

Speaker 1:

It's amazing what kills people? It's shame, and you know a lot of this. We could point to all the reasons. It's just this cultural shame that could rise up from whatever we have as ideas of success or what the generation or our parents should have had easier, um, laid out before someone. And this is all make-believe. It's in your fucking head. Take one problem at a time. And now that you're the CRS, you're the go-to, the guy to say, okay, let's get rid of these barriers. That A would diminish recovery and B diminish the life you should have.

Speaker 2:

And the life they could have Could have. Yeah, and you know it too. Like students will come in and sit with me now, like here's where I'm at, here's where I want to be, what's your gap to get there? And I'll help them with that gap, right. Like a lot of people will come in and say it's too impossible to do, it's too high of a mountain to climb, and I said, listen, if there's anyone that knows, it's me and let's put our egos aside and let's walk together. It's me and let's put our egos aside and let's walk together. Yeah, you know, and they come back. They come back a month later when they do their check-ins.

Speaker 2:

Like, jim, I'm loving my classes, I'm loving my professors and you know what, when I first walked on campus, I was kind of the nerd because I would sit in front of the class. Yeah, I would raise my hand at the end of class and you know the younger, younger students wanting to get out of there when I'm still asking the questions. But I needed to ask questions this time to help my life and to understand why I'm here. What put me here?

Speaker 1:

Jim, I. We have cores here. We call them the 12 fellowship house cores, and the cores were designed as components of what will create the best culture, a culture that could stay with you and then even years or far, far away from fellowship house. It's House, it's the values you can use to create culture for your family and friends, wherever you go. The first one we have is education and we break it down to its kind of Latin roots to shine a light upon, to bring forth, bring up, and we'll give in that lecture. I'll break down learning to three kind of dimensions Western, eastern and Indigenous. So we're not even getting to the point of formal education and we go through ADD, oppositional defiance, things that could have hindered, pre or after or during addiction that you could have blamed. Maybe we can tackle these all together and at the end of that lecture we break it down to services and we break it down to you.

Speaker 1:

You came in that week after and we have a census right now of 30 between two houses, 40 with the outpatient, and our area is blessed with multiple providers, not just us, us and I think education, formal or informal, is essential to stay quotations awake, a life of intention, a life where I have gratitude more easily than depression because I'm alive and I got a second chance To watch you take this position at this program. I think this program should be national news, I think it should be offered to everybody, but to have it right for recovery people. It produces recovery, it keeps recovery. So a few things you have peer support, you have groups that happen weekly. You help manage a schedule that won't be, you know, defeating. Let's just ease into this.

Speaker 2:

And this grant covers what so the grant will cover maintaining a 2.0 or above. Okay, two check-ins with myself and our academic facilitator. If they go through the financial aid process and complete everything they need to complete, we'll help take care of their tuition gap. All right, so if you're in Luzerne County, it's cheaper, of course, than you're living in Lackawanna County. It's double the tuition, and so in county a lot of people can go through the program with no financial problems at all, and not even that too, it's help with books. I need help with books. I can't come up with $500 right now to start the semester. We'll find something to help them. Meaning we have a book lending library of students that are in our program that don't need the books anymore. For someone coming in behind them, it's pretty substantial.

Speaker 1:

I've been in that library, it's big.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, and we turned it into a recovery lounge where people could just go in there, study, eat, talk, connect. But I just want to give you a plug as well, because, growing up and living not too far from your Scranton Greenridge location, driving by that new location, it just blows my mind how it looks today. Right, and I'm connecting with more people in the region because of your podcast, because of your post on social media, and a lot of those industry leaders want to talk with us now because I'm reaching out because of your podcast. Oh great, and it's helping me help students, not just on our main campus in Nanaco, but we have seven satellite campuses. Yeah, you do, and that makes me reach out to more community college in Pennsylvania. So here's what we're doing what are you doing? And we're trying to communicate with them to see if we can all talk the same language for our students.

Speaker 1:

Well, good, I took the liberties of being generous with some of our language community partner. You like that? Well, I say this because there's a portion of our census that comes from not only a tri-state area. It's like this reverse brain drain. This is how I'm looking at it, and this isn't just framework or clever language on my part. We're recruiting talent, we're locating them in Scranton, we're anchoring them here, and a lot of our residents are now signed up for Luzerne. Be it if it's Lackawanna. They went to the University of Scranton, but Luzerne was the great entry level for some of these kids' barriers to not only education but recovery. These kids are extremely talented. They have high sensory. They look at the world with a different perspective and the world returned some cruelty. So addiction was a solution from that and they're going to be talent here. Many of them have plans to live here. The community was so impactful. So it's the reverse of brain drain, this idea. We're just recruiting my favorite people in the world addicts and alcoholics.

Speaker 2:

And you know what, too, I've been seeing as a student transitioning into my professional role there that students will walk in that aren't in recovery, but maybe their mother or father are, or they're in active addiction and they need help and support to get through their classes because it's too much stress on their plate, wow. So we're kind of opening up like the Al-Anon for them as well, man, to support students that want to get away from their home for a few hours and take their classes.

Speaker 1:

That just happened organically. What you're saying is the same thing as a good provider versus a bad. The families, the patient like the whole unit and now that's happening there. I mean, I guess that's just the organic course of what would have happened.

Speaker 2:

And they don't know about it. Yeah, and it's like, once one starts to open their mouth and talk about it more, coming out to saying you know what I do need help. Well, let's talk about some barriers.

Speaker 1:

Someone hears this program. It's still things like so let's see some hurdles Maybe they wouldn't share. I was already in school 10 years ago. Three years ago, 15, 20. Um, I didn't pay back a student loan. They're asking me to fill out a FASA financial aid. What happens when you have a potential student fill that out and they have unpaid uh, stafford loans? How do you guys deal with that?

Speaker 2:

So we have a few options. One we work very closely with OVR Office of Vocational Rehabilitation so they can go there and they can see if they qualify to get some of their education taken care of. Two if they come to LCC, say back 10, 15, 20 years ago, and they have a balance still, we have a debt forgiveness program where they would sign up with our financial aid. They would have to maintain a certain GPA, make sure they're going to all their classes and not fail on any of them, and then the financial aid office will work with them. Wow, and also, too, some of them will go in and say I have a $5,000 or $10,000 balance. They just want to see a good faith pay. If you go to them and say I can give you X per month to get me where I'm going, they'll work with you.

Speaker 1:

And you just walk someone through that.

Speaker 2:

And that's it. And you know what too?

Speaker 1:

We sit down and say all right, what are all?

Speaker 2:

the barriers. Yeah, let's take them one at a time, cause, joe, you know, in early recovery we want everything back yesterday, yeah, and the world's ending. Right, let's get. Let's hunker down, yeah, but um, no. So once they start seeing that they take their deep breath and they exhale that there are people that want to help. You know, and I always say this too, like when I so my home, I practice AA and my home group is in Pittston and it's the junction group on Sunday nights, but that's where I met people that worked at the treatment center, where I was going, when I walked in there and when I was celebrating my three, six, nine months, my year, who was in there hugging me? People that never even seen me or met me before, right, where are the people that ran with me for 20 years? None of them were around.

Speaker 1:

I'm waiting for them. They'll arrive soon, right?

Speaker 2:

There was one that came and I want to give him a shout out Tommy Hurst, one of my boys. He's the king man, hurst Hearst one of my boys, he's the king man, hearstie, is going strong, he's doing fantastic, but the support from people that I know from my hometown that say Jamie, you can keep doing it, keep going, keep going there's a purpose for all this.

Speaker 1:

So that's one complexity. You just took that chess piece off the board and half the battle would be to show up to an appointment. Just keep showing up to the appointment, you'll find out. You'll find a way into the school and it's very the highway and the entry is very broad and it could change your life. Because if thought is contained to just language um, and you're limited in your thoughts to your language, education will change your life. It'll change your world, because if you change your mind, the world is changing. I really love the support you've been giving our guys. I'm really happy for the new position. Is there anything about this program that I'm failing to kind of explore? That you think is a challenge or frequently asked question from people.

Speaker 2:

No, we're covering everything, but there is something that I do want to touch on. So, like I said, I was unhirable, I had no skills and I always thought I was entitled that why don't I get the promotion? Or they owe me more money, right? And when I got hired five weeks ago and I started full time, this isn't a job for me, this is my career, this is something I love to do, it's a way of life, right, yeah? And like I show up early, I leave late and I want to be there to help because it's it. It gave me a sense of purpose that you know. I waited.

Speaker 2:

I dropped out of school in 2000 and I waited 22 years to get a job and two months after I graduated, I got a full-time job with benefits and everything that I need to help and to take that frustration off my plate. Am I going to get a job out of graduation? It might take six months to a year. I just patiently did this without working. For how many months, how many years? But I still have to stay the course. And when the job came up, I jumped on it because I was doing this as a student.

Speaker 1:

You were, you were in the office doing this for other people. When I was there, I was.

Speaker 2:

And you know what? The the? The ladies are going to laugh and yell at me, but they they kind of still see me once in a while as their work study. The ladies are going to laugh and yell at me, but they kind of still see me once in a while as their work study the shred papers or go get this for us. But you know what? That's just their support for me. Yeah, and it helps. You've got a great team.

Speaker 1:

They're a part of my family. The whole staff there is really special and that's a special program. You're in a great environment. It's a dream job.

Speaker 2:

And after Jan and I left a few weeks ago talking to your guys here, melissa and I talked about getting with you, coming up with the hand handshake, moving forward for your guys that come in. We would love to do this not just once every three months or every semester. Come up even more because now we offer certified recovery specialist classes that are I got two ready to sign up, man.

Speaker 2:

Yep, that are going to be on the Wilkes-Barre LLC campus on the square, and we partnered with Northbound Recovery Hub. What they're going to be doing now, I believe it's Tuesday, thursday, saturday for a month.

Speaker 1:

That's a great company Northbound and coorg. You can check that out. It's October 15th through November 16th this year, tuesdays and Thursdays at six to nine and on Saturdays, nine 30 to 4 PM. That's a Luzerne County community college. To public square, wilkes-barre, pa. Check it out.

Speaker 1:

Two of the guys that I had in mind. I know what this is and I know what the experience has been from a handful of people. This milestone of getting it's a really, really good class. I took this training. The information blew my mind. I spent 14 years in recovery. What the hell are you going to teach me? Even when I came back, 90% of the information I had no clue. It was like the the, the reality and data of addiction and my misunderstanding to my own stigmas, being a person that was in recovery, where it was breathtaking, it was astonishing what I did and it changed my life. Hence us sitting here and I'm good I know this will happen for other people here that are brilliant and they're in our program and they're scared of school and they want to take this course, though, because they love recovery, they love knowing they figured out what's wrong with them. I know after that class, knowing they figured out what's wrong with them, I know after that class.

Speaker 2:

It's whatever the they're, they're boundless. This class could be a stepping stone for them to remove that barrier. Let me just dip my toe in the water with these. With these classes for a month and the benefits of it they get six credits towards their graduation, which is awesome. So what I just did from March to May yes, I'm getting a full-time position with it, but that would have been nice to get six more credits towards Penn State, towards my junior year. Yeah, but with this program for a month and I believe we're going to start doing this every semester for them that they can get certified, they can get certified quicker. That'll go towards their graduation at LCC with their credits and I believe it goes through all majors.

Speaker 1:

The course breaks down into a lot of great topics that you'd be surprised Diversity, training diversity, multiple populations, the disparity of how trauma and addiction rises, and socioeconomic statuses. Almost some discussions on de-escalation, how people pay, what a Medicaid population is, what ethics are when approaching someone, especially their information and what they're comfortable with. It's a real comprehensive, exciting course.

Speaker 2:

I still have the handbook on my desk opened up because I'm still learning from it. My class ended I think it was May 18th, and I took the test right away because I graduated May 23rd, so I wanted my associates and my cert all lined up before I got hired. Yeah, and I still go back to that. I didn't know what a recovery capital was. Yeah, and now I'm creating that for the students and putting an environment around them so when they're not on our campus, they can still succeed with their self-care, their recovery, their life, their education, their family. But just little things like that I'm pulling out of and customizing it for our students.

Speaker 1:

And just the importance of what would seem so bland vanilla documentation. How it's not about. It's about protecting people and I found that their approach to that in the class was comprehensive could serve you the rest of your life in this field.

Speaker 2:

I wish I could tell everybody to go back and do this program, but you know, for me it's let me worry about myself first, let me get right so I can help others. And, um, when Jana and I left here that day, she's like what a great building, what a great staff here and the clients are amazing. I think you have a couple already signed up for our fall semester and, um, you know, we're willing to come up and sit with them. So they can't, if they can't travel down, we're willing to come up and sit with them. So if they can't travel down, we're going to come up and sit with them, and if they have any kind of problems or barriers with their online classes, we'll get the right people in front of them.

Speaker 1:

We've got a study hall we just built out.

Speaker 2:

That's awesome.

Speaker 1:

A computer lab on the first floor. Guys are excited, they're ready, we have backup tutors and I think they have to get more familiar with the services, so I'm looking forward to it.

Speaker 2:

I guess I guess I could say that this is this was the. This is the scholarship I was looking for. I had the athletic scholarship back then, but this is the team that I wanted to be on my whole life. Right, the biggest one in the world is staying sober, helping another alcoholic or drug addict and continuing to push this in the right direction. And what you're doing again online is eye-opening, not just for myself, but the community, just connecting and it spiders out from one of your podcasts. I've talked to three different people at three different agencies that want to help.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, and it's the connection from you and I had back in the day Well.

Speaker 1:

I'll end with some CRS facts. 22 million Americans identify in some form of recovery. There might be 3 million in the NRA at any given time. Can you imagine if there was a political voice in a lobby for resources that improved and empowered lives, maybe just education? That'd be a really dangerous organization that could never be ignored. If we had half of that, and not even having a political slant, just as a slant towards the dignity any social workers should fight for, what if we all started talking? 22 million people.

Speaker 2:

Well, we have to start somewhere, and I believe it starts from within, with that person, and it expands out. But just spreading the word is going to help. And it's tough, but I will do one speech at a time, one campus at a time, to talk to people about stigma, about judgment and, you know, not to put so much pressure on the person trying to change their life. No, extend a hand to help them.

Speaker 1:

Jim, it was great having you. I got to go start IOP. I'm out of counselor.

Speaker 2:

I got to go to my orientation online tonight, all right, thanks for having me. This has been a grateful pleasure and I really appreciate it.

Speaker 1:

You're going to get the sound effect right.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I'm official.

Speaker 1:

I'd like to thank you for listening to another episode of All Better. You can find us on allbetterfm or listen to us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google Podcasts, Stitcher, iHeartRadio and Alexa. Special thanks to our producer, John Edwards, and engineering company 570 Drone. Please like or subscribe to us on YouTube, Facebook, Instagram or Twitter and, if you're not, on social media, you're awesome. Looking forward to seeing you again. And remember, just because you're sober doesn't mean you're right.