Meet Tee Martin, Beatnik, gentleman , outlaw, musician, and clinician extradiore just celebrated 36 years of sobriety.
Tee has been at Alina Lodge since 2003, prior to this he was the Clinical Coordinator of the "Dunes" in East Hampton, NY, also worked as a Counselor at the Marworth Adolescent Facility "Shawnee" in Pennsylvania throughout 1990's. We discuss the earlier setting of his life in Scranton's section of Bellevue, to his departure to New York City in the earlier 1960's when his addiction truly matured. We also discuss the impact inpatient treatment had on him in the 1980's at the newly opened "Marworth" drug and alcohol treatment center.
Tee has had a profound impact on my life, and my views concerning addiction and it's recovery. This is the first time I was able to discuss his childhood in such detail in a way that left me moved in regards to the realities we all may carry quietly. His voice has always had a hypnotic effect on my imagination, the City he describes will seem like an alien planet to many. Yet all the same this landscape of "Bellevue" forged some giants, and Tee is one of them in the field of treatment.
Joe Van Wie 0:02
WARNING for this episode, our guest speaks to trauma and maltreatment and abuse from his own personal story. He's done this in the past under clinical setting and with therapy. I send this as a warning to anyone who has experienced trauma themselves when hearing other traumas, it could be triggering when discussing your own trauma, it's under good advisement, to do it in a therapeutic setting with a licensed clinician.
Hello, and thanks for listening to another episode of all better. I'm Joe van wie your host. Today we have T Martin T. Martin is a Scranton native, and my cousin. He's been in long term sobriety for 36 years. Today we get to meet to talk a little bit about the world in which he grew up in and what produced the events of his recovery. The last 30 years T has been in the drug and alcohol treatment field as a drug and alcohol counselor started at Shawnee adolescent Drug and Alcohol Treatment Center. Since 2003, tea has been at Alina lodge as drug and alcohol counselor, who's also the clinical coordinator at the dunes in East Hampton, New York. Not too many times have I been Sobrato surprised about drugs or older new. Today I was with a drug I've never heard of my entire life. It was called Dr. Smith's asthma door. And this was a drug he found many others, which we'll hear about today, and how he recovered. I hope you enjoy it. This is part one. Pete Martin.
Tee Martin 2:19
Delphi in drunk, walked into maurward the 9086 and didn't leave for five years. At the end of dad, I was the clinical coordinator at their adolescent program up and shiny.
Joe Van Wie 2:40
So that you buy and
Tee Martin 2:41
I've been working with adolescent headaches. Currently at Pakistan Hospital is a partial hospitalization program. I guess is there anything else you want to know
Joe Van Wie 2:58
now? I was just gonna write a bio. I want to I want to welcome you to all better. Okay, and this is my cousin. T Martin. Oh, my mother's first cousin. And I want to start from the beginning. I think a T. Who are where did you begin?
Tee Martin 3:18
Begin? Yeah, here in Scrat, I was born. That's great.
Joe Van Wie 3:22
What did that look like?
Tee Martin 3:26
Oh, it was very different. It was a very vibrant. It was the electric city. Sure. Now we had maybe five movie theaters downtown. All those businesses that have not closed were full of retail people. And guys, we had the department stores the dry goods in blob store and all that stuff.
Joe Van Wie 3:53
What decade are we looking at
Tee Martin 3:55
all now? I grew up in Bellevue in the 1940s. So 40s into the 50s through the 50s.
Joe Van Wie 4:07
And for someone listening where would Bellevue be. Bellevue
Tee Martin 4:11
is located just across the bridge from the flats, a Holy Cross Church and Holy Cross was the parish. Yeah. I got in trouble there. As a child, a lot of trouble is young Sarah, I couldn't. I suppose nowadays, I'd say you know, I had some part of the alphabet, ADHD ad, whatever, in some letters. And it's like when my old man came back. After the war, he called the St. Vitus dance. One of the first things I remember I was perched on the top of the steps there in Bellevue at the house. It was like, a more or less than right? Because this is my father. He's just come home. I have no conscious memory of this guy. Except a couple of blips, you know, during a war, right? Yeah, I do now I have my own sailor so just like the sailors had back then they were those caps. Yeah, the Black Caps with the ribbon. So he was he overseas for World War Two? No, he wasn't. He was somewhere up and down. Because college, I think. But yeah, it was a whole different consciousness. Yeah. Yeah. One of my first memories and I've been writing about this recently. Which is I guess I must have been three or four I was VJ Day. I remember being on the front porch. But my mom and mag mag was like my grandmother. Yeah, I drove her mad. She called me the devil. I thought that was my name, devil. Your genitals whereas the eyes up to his devilment somewhere dead woman. What it is, cuz I couldn't stay put in that one time they resorted to tie me up to this thing. It was an old boiler turned into a planter in the backyard. On his long rope, so I had room to do something on play. It's like, cuz I would wander off
Joe Van Wie 6:53
in venture. What do you think that was? You just drawn to adventure?
Tee Martin 6:56
Always? Yeah. Always want to see what's over there. Yeah, you know, curiosity. Yeah, I guess. And adventure, too. Yeah. I was obsessed with cowboys.
Joe Van Wie 7:09
Yeah, I think all good drunk, sir. You know?
Tee Martin 7:13
Anyway, I remember. You know, here it is. It's VJ Day, right. And I was banging on a pot with a spoon trying to make as much noise as possible. The people in front of the bars across the street nicks and pellets, Pelican. And I think one guy he was even shooting the gun off in the air. Everybody was screaming and yelling VJ Day and all that stuff. And upon reflection, I didn't know that what I was celebrating was the Happy Birthday of debt. Yeah. But who knew?
Joe Van Wie 7:56
Right MVG This is the end of World War Two. That was it. And what ended it was the bombing of Hiroshima, I guess an atomic, two atomic weapons going off Nagasaki and Hiroshima. Right.
Tee Martin 8:12
So it gets us to that point in time. I was part of the first generation that lived in the shadow of the mom. Yeah,
Joe Van Wie 8:19
anymore. But, and the shadows getting darker now seems to be moving.
Tee Martin 8:26
But we had good. Oh my god. I remember I stole or firewood, because everything was on the coal stuff back then. Right. And so I took the wood off the back porch and put it in my little wagon. I don't know how old I was four or five. And I took it up the alley to Eddie Delaney. And I sold it to her. I always had a penchant for that sort of thing. Get stuff and sell the house I and she was wild. When I got back you sold my buyer was Eddie Delaney was this old lady who live with my husband Bootsie up on Fourth Street, right. But I'd go there via the back alley and I love to climb there. Adam one binary tree. It's good for climb. But she was old you know. I always say as a nickel go get yourself a slice a piece of pies. That's what she called it at busters. Wow. As he had the pro Ferriss slice pizza on the counter.
Joe Van Wie 9:42
Was that exotic then to pizza? Well, now is everywhere. Up for the call was like a coal miner kind of.
Tee Martin 9:51
I see. Yeah, I guess. But that was the deal all the time. She was it To kill me. Jesus Mary and Joseph devil yes sold my words and deeds a lady.
Joe Van Wie 10:08
What? to Bellevue for the 40s. Washington in the 50s. What? How would you explain to someone who can't visualize this what the drinking was for the culture? It's a predominantly Irish, blue collar, cold cracking neighborhood where the Irish came to settle. It really developed themselves in Scranton, what would you? What would you say? The role alcohol played as a medication?
Tee Martin 10:38
Well? Oh, absolutely. Yeah. Yes. I was T down whiskey and para gorrik. Yeah. So ironic. Now, I don't blame my alcoholism on anything. No. Yeah, I don't care if I Yeah, somebody stuck out my back when I wasn't looked on. came in the mail. I got it from a public toilet is irrelevant.
Joe Van Wie 11:02
It is like being born in North America. Whose fault was that? Yeah.
Tee Martin 11:05
It's like what I'm running to do about it. But it's just ironic, right. But it was a remedy as well. Yeah. Especially back then I remember, you know, kids have the sippy cups. You know, kids all have their favorite cup. And I had one that was on the first shelf of the pantry in the kitchen. That was a shot glass with a little red devil on it. That was my
Joe Van Wie 11:39
as your name. So as soon as my name on it. Yeah.
Tee Martin 11:43
And so we use it for various things. You know, you got whiskey and lemon and honey cold. Of which I had many. Yeah. Because they didn't have a vaccine for whooping cough back then. So I got whooping cough as a kid. So I was, yeah. A lot of respiratory difficulty. And it was so different. Because we go up to Dr. McHugh up on Main Street on the side and he'd be there right with the stessa stethoscope around his neck. And a cigarette in his mouth. Right. He told my mom and dad take them for walks down by the gasworks clear them up as they walk by the gas house every night. Wow. So I was going down inhale and all these noxious chemicals. Right. But who knew? Right? And I also was prescribed all those elixirs.
Joe Van Wie 13:00
Yeah. Which was predominantly alcohol. codeine? Yeah, maybe some cocaine.
Tee Martin 13:05
Exactly. Yeah. And so I remember in my room, I take those things. I had this thing like, and it was a I guess a vaporizer. It was like this little metal plate that plugged into the wall and there was something on there like creosote or some damn thing,
Joe Van Wie 13:26
like, would act as a mental, like, around
Tee Martin 13:29
black. Wow, thick stuff while and yeah, I remember laying in bed and I could on the wall, I could see the cars going up and down Broadway, you know, a brief like that.
Joe Van Wie 13:42
It's amazing. It's the technology and the treatments and the prescriptions of walking around gaseous chemicals sounds like something from what we would a kid today would recognize the Bronze Age, the very see little very difference between both of them, but we're still under the threat of the bomb. It's the same world. It's the same exact world.
Tee Martin 14:08
When things that were very significant in light of what you're talking about was like, well, two things that stand out like one day, of course, got out of the backyard, and I went wandering up to Holy Cross Church, right. And those days, churches were always open. And so I went in, and in the vestibule it looked like a shirt box full of miraculous metal. Right. And so to me, in my little mind, it looked like pirate treasure. So I took so I started walking down Broadway with this box and some guy stopped me he said what do you got net box a little boy? I said metals you want Alright, so I was on for a nickel sure enough here comes at mag and she got me right and just what the hell are you doing now your devil so I said I found these they were to charge this is actually took me by the year up to Dr. O Mara to priest house. Yeah and he liked to be called doctor because he's got this Doctor of Divinity right but he was like right out of central casting congratulations on your fat white here dude. cassock says Leave him to me I'll sorted him out. And he she did and so he takes me by the air yeah across the street and locked me in the church. I didn't know I was like Dan but he brought me up to the altar rally had me kneel down and ask God to forgive me for the terrible sin committed to finding pirate treasure. Right? And then, you know,
Joe Van Wie 16:08
is it confusing planet to be born on to be schooled by Yeah,
Tee Martin 16:11
there was another little kid with me. I can't remember his name but the delivers in Nealon there I'm looking around and I bless him the mother looks heartbroken. St. Joseph face holes in the baby. He looks disappointed but St Michael on the window. He was gonna kick my ass. Kill me with that sword. Yeah, that was like,
Joe Van Wie 16:40
He's the boss's Enforcer.
Tee Martin 16:41
So I was freaking out. I ran to the front to get out of there. But he had locked the doors. Creepy. So the two of us run all around the place trying to find a way out. We finally got down to the basement and got in the sink. So we could you know crawl through the window. Wow. Solar Wind and Ron Hall. Because that May. And by now my mom was almost like a well Dieter Omarosa straighten you out house. Oh, yes. Oh, yes. Doctor now was all good. But the other thing was my first Well, here's an odd thing to I was an Irish Catholic kid, right. And my babysitter, my first babysitter was Joni Hillman. Gather us there. And so she would take me across the street and I spend a lot of the time with what I call them uncle Morris. And Alia, who is also known as Bertie, because he could imitate bird sounds. That was a little touched, I suppose. But he peddled papers in town, because back then guys peddled papers in up, you know? Center City, and they just were beyond the sidewalk. Hearken. Newspapers. Always had newspapers, the Blue Streak editions of the Tribune, the times in the afternoon, and yet, oh my god, little tablets, he'd sell on pencils. And also rubbers.
Joe Van Wie 18:37
Like condoms. I don't even think they were a thing back then.
Tee Martin 18:43
Yeah, I didn't know what they were sure. Yeah, sure. But, yeah, I spend a lot of time over the uncle Morris's. And they were at the docks, Jews. Yeah. And they were my caretakers sense. Oh, Morris. Uncle Boris. Yeah. And later, I couldn't figure out why people hated uncle Morrison and Jews. i Yeah. I never understood that. It was just like,
Joe Van Wie 19:10
especially getting to know him prior to the discrimination or understanding. Yeah, yeah.
Tee Martin 19:17
I can't remember the first person but I think I remember I was going to Michael Morris. Yeah. What's a Kike? I didn't know. And he told
Joe Van Wie 19:29
you, you have to be taught to, you know, to be rational. It was sort of
Tee Martin 19:36
sad awakening. Yeah. To that kind of stuff I didn't understand. So I loved uncle Morris. My guy yeah. So aside from those folks. I had a buddy, Joe Kearney. He was certainly The older he was an adult, right? I don't know how old Joe will abandon at the time. My mom found a picture of send it to me some years ago. But he would come down the alley and he would yell over the fence. Has my boozing companion say?
Joe Van Wie 20:24
How old are you at this point?
Tee Martin 20:26
Five or six over six. Okay. The thing with Joe is our custom was, Joey, come on, let me out. The backyard cut the line, yet the whole man because I couldn't. I wasn't allowed to cross the street by myself. Sure. And we go over the pelvics right across across Broadway. Because we lived at the corner of Broadway and Third Avenue we called. Anyway, we'd go to the bar. And I was I would stand on the stool. Yeah. And it was like Joe's conversation piece. I'm sure he got some free drinks. So I loved being obsessed with cowboys. It was like I was in a saloon, right? Yeah. So we had a routine. We go in and He lifted me up, put me on top of the barstool and bang the bar. Hey, bartender, the bartender would come. And they knew me. Yeah. This is a short bear. And you get like a pony glass of bears off. And he'd started to walk away. That was part of the routine. And I bang on the bar again, and shouts salt. And he bring me a salt shaker and I hit that beer once with the shaker and drink that stuff. It was delicious. Yeah. Yeah.
Joe Van Wie 21:59
Guy five, six years old. Yeah, Scranton life.
Tee Martin 22:03
But damn, what happened one day? Well, was was a six. I don't know. Anyway, we were we did that one day. And what happened was I just didn't know what happened. It was like one second. I was standing on a stool over there, across the street. And I wasn't and when I came to myself is I can't mag was waking me up. In a sense, I'll never forget or Jesus, Mary and Joseph devil. Look at what you're doing. And it came to myself. And I was peeing all over the array or in a room. Yeah. And all of a sudden, I didn't know how I got there. And I I don't know. I was ashamed. Shocked, confused, scared. All of the above all at once. I was like, hell, because you know, I was coming out of a blackout. Think. Oh, this isn't the bathroom is jarring? Yeah. I guess in the blackout. I thought I went upstairs. I thought I was going to the bathroom. And the radiator. Yeah.
Joe Van Wie 23:31
This is the end of your childhood. This how it is through the waking up of a blackout. It's like the loss of innocence. I never
Tee Martin 23:39
knew what that was until I got sober.
Joe Van Wie 23:43
Tee Martin 23:45
But wow. You would think a person has an experience like that they'd never touch it again. Yeah. But I'm not powerless. If it was potato chips. Yeah, that caused this. I probably never would have had another potato chip my life but I'm not powerless over potato chip because
Joe Van Wie 24:04
they don't release dopamine. They don't release
Tee Martin 24:08
so yeah. Yeah, I always to be repeated experience later on many times, many times over. So we'll never forget that. Oh, my God, and that next day. May Chase Joe currently a Third Avenue was called xevil. And he was banned. Yeah. And Pat because he used to come to the house anyway. Because my uncles I like those metal Jimmy, my grandfather. Yes, indeed. Your grandfather. My godfather was never Oh, he was my hero. I love them because every time he'd show up, he's always dressed to the nines right? And he gave me like a $5 bill and say here Good. Go get Has yourself an ice cream cone.
Joe Van Wie 25:03
That was great. It was like a gangster read. He
Tee Martin 25:06
was great. Anyway, it was a huge figure, and my childhood. But anyway, Joe Klein he used to come by the house and because the guys were Undertaker's and all they had all kinds of clothes still there. And so it would be like this. Joe would come by. And my mother and man did say once I surely it's a gel, and he'd say, well, nine for size 10 for comfort and aid for snugness wonderful characters there, especially over across the street zankel Morris on these houses and they were occupied by people like Harry's and not and his mother, Harry the nut. Buried the neck got stuck in the Gemini at Christmastime one time, he was a surprises mother. The fire department over there everything Oh, Lord. And then Harry got married to another he must have been a crazy woman by and so they moved into the house next door to Harry's mother which uncle Morris also and so of all things. Wait, was that when the dog? No. He and the wife split up. He married a different guy and workout. So Harry gave them a dog as a wedding presents these two people. So he gave out Italy and parents were living in this house. He moved back with his mother. Wow. And then the wife and her new husband went next door with the dog. But they didn't know how to handle the dog. They never took him out. Yeah, plus they were used the banisters and stuff in the house for firewood. Oh, Jesus, they were slow taken place. So
Joe Van Wie 27:21
this is this is wild. This is Bellevue in the 40s.
Tee Martin 27:30
I'm afraid of das dos to this day because it seemed led second to first 3g and along Broadway to somebody's mother would always have their head in the oven.
Joe Van Wie 27:44
Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Out of distress, despair. Despair,
Tee Martin 27:50
like Josef's mother put her head in the oven again. And they come and they take her away.
Joe Van Wie 27:58
And there was no clear way to talk about this. That it was you know, it was pretty binary the way you viewed things. Yeah. Either survivor or the guest. I was a blow up. Yeah, it'd be a fire.
Tee Martin 28:12
course the other thing was right a lot wrong alongside a gun Wars was was a train tracks, right? Yeah. Because we're always told don't play on the drags and beware of the third rail and all that stuff. But of course, what do you do
Joe Van Wie 28:26
in a play? Right.
Tee Martin 28:29
So I love to go across the street. And then if I went up further on this steep embankment, led to a wall and that was the Lackawanna River, right, which later flooded the whole neighborhood and that was the end of Bellevue, but and everyone threw their ashes over there, right? Yeah, but these huge scallions grew there. And I love to go eat this gal. Yes. Yeah. But yeah, so we play on the drag some kid. Just God, I have a phobia about electricity. Did he die? This incidentally.
Joe Van Wie 29:16
God is no protection to right now. Really? You can reach the third rail for the electric.
Tee Martin 29:22
Yeah, well, I was cool. Because you could go down those tracks by on the other side of the street. And it led to the Roundhouse. The Brown was fascinated which
Joe Van Wie 29:34
changed. Oh, yeah,
Tee Martin 29:37
yeah. So the Roundhouse boys, they can corner us there.
Joe Van Wie 29:42
It was the beat up the infield. But a
Tee Martin 29:46
lot of things happened in that empty lot by the tracks. I saw the big boys fight for the first time. Not true the first time at the first time where it was knives. Yeah. A series find all the blood I remember I remember but gotta get I was I guess I thought it was pretty cool.
Joe Van Wie 30:12
Oh yeah did you have any scary sure but I don't think you you have two choices it's either scary or or cool ones gonna make life easier that it's cool especially living in Belize
Tee Martin 30:25
yeah pretty wildly crazy out loud. And there was also words do bars where next next bar near give it said that bar it two sons Franny and Nikki and then the other big edifice on the other side was a Russian Orthodox Church so that was fascinating too because they had had these pageants and stuff. It's Daddy Cool bye would come at Christmas time and the wise men and stuff and people would be dressed in costumes and Easter the Polish people would all bring their hams and stuff to be blessed as a priest. Very fascinating. And then across the street from an era gone up Broadway was Charlie Rolex butcher shop I go up there with my mother and my favorite thing was he would do this every time I get a slice of Bologna of course sample and he made me this toy it was a chicken foot he dies during on the tendon of the check down foot so when I pulled him out wow, yeah, good job to pick things up with it's tough. I was like, that was one of my toys.
Joe Van Wie 31:57
It sounds like an alien planet to what you see today. Or even understand the Scranton right?
Tee Martin 32:04
I guess it was a dysfunctional neighborhood. I loved it. Then there was a constant crap game up against the side of Uncle Morris's sweet shop a be called shop pay. But it was funny too, because the cops every time the cops would come by and it was really classic stuff. It was like geez at the cops, right. So the game had shut down. It was a past at age resume. It was always it was nonstop. Beautiful. Beautiful thing.
Joe Van Wie 32:40
What was it like entering high school at that time? Your teenage years?
Tee Martin 32:45
Oh, well, that was different.
Joe Van Wie 32:48
Yeah. What change?
Tee Martin 32:50
I something I don't think Oh. My whole life changed. When I was seven, yeah. That's when we moved. I Yeah.
Joe Van Wie 33:16
lease up. Yeah. Okay. We took a break to have a cigarette on my porch. And what I realized was that we all have a story to tell about our pain, split people with addiction, and people in recovery. Getting down to the original pain, it could be abandonment, subtle as maybe attunement, not taking hold in the first two years. Or it could be a trauma, real or perceived. And beginning to understand this objectively, without judgment is a process. Most people who achieve long term sobriety get to experience it could be 12 steps. It could be in the form of cognitive behavioral therapy. But what it requires is connection with another person and telling your real life story which you may not even be aware of up to this point. And talking about trauma gets down to a fundamental idea of what you consider will and free will. So that's something just get over something you need to understand. And to hear ideas like that it gets down to the idea of how many of us even willed ourselves what to be alive. Did we choose to be born in North America, the color of our eyes, our religion, and once you fish around in that space, it opens you up to be objective about out your own history, and your own hurts and pains and to be able to speak about it to really connect that we're not too different. And people with addiction have this unresolved pain that begins to heal, when we open up and discuss it with another person that understands tea wants to do that today. And tea has always been one of my heroes, and my cousin, and a person I admire and care about deeply. He wants to talk more, so we come back to pick up the story. And T tells his real story, which he knows and believes, will help people understand that addiction is not your fault. It's your response to the world you emerged him. But knowing that your life becomes your responsibility to move forward, and maybe help someone else
so we're back from a quick smoke break, and we're gonna pick back up from tea is now just departed from Bellevue. And I just wanted to have tea on definitely to memorialize my favorite cousin, and his stories of his life because just of the profound impact he had on me, since I'm 16, and a little boy, but 16, especially I don't know if you remember this to you. I had to go to Clearbrook Lodge and shinny. In the first piece of mail, the first couple nights I was there, I was starting to realize it and have mail people this was a an event every night people get their mail, get time to read it. And the first three nights I didn't get any I'm thinking of course you don't get any but it was like, Oh, it's a weird feeling to sit and watch other people read mail, and I get a piece of mail. And it's the first week I'm there. It's a postcard. And on the front is Van Gogh Starry Night postcard, I turned around. And it says Hey, what's up cuz it was a really sentimental note to me. But in the end it said, Congratulations, you just joined the most expensive club in the world. You've paid your dues. And it was from you.
Tee Martin 37:41
I was like, God, I forgot how
Joe Van Wie 37:43
I did it. I still have it.
Tee Martin 37:46
That's wonderful. So Recovery
Joe Van Wie 37:49
to me and when I think of family outside of my father is you are the idea of recovery, that the earliest idea of I have a bit that looked really enticing because of how interesting your your life was, and you survived it. That that was always in my head. I couldn't articulate what it meant but I knew it meant something just talking to you how you carried yourself and then that you were really comfortable in sobriety because I wouldn't have considered anything else here. We seem like you were comfortable with yourself. So I'm really glad you made it up here today from Jersey to have the chat and I want to go back to leaving Bellevue and this idea of what Martin's Diner is what is Martin's diner because this is what forms us we
Tee Martin 38:51
I will talk about the other thing because I think it's important okay you know I said I wasn't going anyway we were to move from Bellevue I went with my father and mother Matt a friend to his up to this new house they didn't want to take me I was a pain has And in any event they did they were gonna I don't know wallpaper paint whenever I was running around that new house exploring you know, I was first thing I did was go all the way up to the attic and start poking around and the interesting stuff that was left up there Yeah. And this thing further away can i Yeah, absolutely. All right, I think I don't know. Anyway, so there I was. I must have just been seven I guess. Pushing seven who knows? But I'm running around this house fella. This friend of my father's was a very excitable guy. My father liked to tease him get him sad. He thought that was very funny. Like pranks on this guy all the time, just as get him to react and he was very volatile. He would turn red, when he would be spitting mad, literally, right, smiting Matt. And my father, that was very funny. Any event, I went downstairs, I was running around, I knocked over the wallpaper, pasted the paint, whatever it was. Never forget it, because he my father was sitting opposite each other and his arm Jews in the living room. That man got very upset with me. And went into one has tantrums, if you want to call it that.
And he took off his belt, and he beat me. They beat me up and down my back legs. To the point where some of the welds were bleeding. And when I went home,
and my father watched watched it. And it was, oh my god. Something like, I don't know. 36 years later, I'm sitting in a treatment center up at Warwick. One night. There. You know what a few guys are talking about their lives. And for some reason. For the first time ever since it happened. I remember. I had never even had suppressed it. Push it down so deeply. I never remembered it until then. And I don't know what the other guy said that triggered it. But there it was. And I realized that that's when I stopped trusting people. I guess it's important to say that to understand. I became a professional paranoid, I guess. Yeah. Later. Yeah. I mean,
Joe Van Wie 42:36
I think most people that I've gelled and created long lasting friendships in recovery with, we eventually get to a point where we get to know each other and what what recovery means to us means knowing each other, or our whole stories. And there's that moment where the world becomes unsafe, and untrustworthy. For addicts that I relate to and and alcoholics. And it's, it's a real No, no, it's something I don't take for granted anymore. The fact that I've been alive long enough to understand that's how I connect with people. When it gets down to push comes to shove this is this the story we tell to get better? Yeah, I can relate to that deeply to the effect that I had a ritual for years to where I go to sleep. When I lived in New York, when I lived here and apartments, I would I would scan the room and fall asleep. That's how I fell asleep sober. This is why drinking was so it was just another benefit of drinking could collapse me into asleep. I would envision how someone would break in that night what my tactical advantages would be engaged them and when I ran myself exhausted by this fall asleep because I always felt a sense of that was under constant threat, especially when I was alone or left with my thoughts and it comes from my childhood of events that mirror yours. And I think when I talked to alcoholics and we're going through the steps are this process of connecting something in the world robbed us of that and we find out while the world is a little darker and we don't know people aren't well at seven Amanda form who I was going to be as an adult and it it makes having long relationships very hard.
Tee Martin 44:42
Joe Van Wie 44:45
Well, that was I want to thank you for the talking about that. And I'm really curious on what the rest of the next Maybe decade look like to you were 17 What what what brought you out of your parents home who now moved out of Bellevue into your grandparents house their formative years and is this where you've probably perfected your your you know, libertarian ways?
Tee Martin 45:23
Right. libertine men and Scarlet women. Anyway, yeah. So you either almost immediately after, it seems in my mind anyway, we moved up there to hell right and left Bellevue behind, which was later to be destroyed by the flood 55. At mag was still on that house, she wouldn't leave to add some guys in a rowboat and take her. Take her out, you know? Anyway. Yeah, even though I really. I can't describe that. The grandfather gave my father his son that houses a distant fellow i It's not like I didn't ever think of him as a grandpa or anything. As matter of fact, never use that word. was always your grandfather. I don't think he ever hugged or kissed me ever.
Joe Van Wie 46:38
Wow, what was it like we go
Tee Martin 46:40
to visit him. He lived over in. Let's grant and we go over there to visit him. I'll never forget it. He lived at that time with his sister. And Alice, who was a sweet lady. And she'd give me these those butters, scotch candies. But he and my father would talk I don't even even know what the hell they talked about. But I would just have to occupy myself somehow wasn't included in
Joe Van Wie 47:19
Tee Martin 47:23
I'll never forget one time I had gotten finally a football helmet because we used to play an empty lots back stuff. Playing without a helmet. And finally I convinced my father gave me just this cheap plastic football helmet. And one time my grandfather was at the house and I had a football helmet. I'm gonna go out and play football. He says Oh sure. Our you're gonna play football and all this stuff guy just ready to kill him. You can't do that. Like what kind of football player are you? You know, because I was sleight of bells and short at that time. And then the other time I remember a discourse with Tim. I only remember two exchanges with this guy. He was at the house on the hill and he come by and now I was proud of the fact I said you know, I've been shooting pool at the boys club place. Pretty good at it. And all he said to me was you show me a pool shark and I'll show you a bomb those are the only memories I have with this guy. No, strange. But anyway, yeah. Martin's diner, right. Yeah. The story was that my Uncle Jack smile and Jack want in a card game?
Joe Van Wie 49:07
I don't know. In Paris diner,
Tee Martin 49:10
or whatever. It was in con themself into it. Yeah, in one way or another. But of course, Jack never worked a day in his life. So my father finally Yeah, he's managing. He's managing this diner. I'll never forget it and great at Catherine waltz. Yeah. Yeah, Rosemary sister. Because they both lived in Bellevue was the cache here. Right? Which was funny.
Joe Van Wie 49:49
Prim, prim and proper game
Tee Martin 49:53
being the cashier because it was basically a gambling joy. Punch Board said Every stool at the counter, and one in every booth. And in case you missed it, there was another one at the cash register. Don't forget, there was a large side room that was full of pinball machines. And they were going constantly, constantly guys dropping nickels in these things. And they were everyone paid off, of course. So we had Blackie there and he made the pay offs if it was $100 or more, if not, my dad made the payout. Yeah, right. I'll never forget it was this crazy chef or cook in the back. He couldn't go near him. Best to leave him alone because he had wild fits of anger. With a knife in his hand. Joe lane. Well, I don't bother Joe lane. And of course, God there was a waitress there that I thought she was wonderful. She had these long fingernails, and they were always painted face and hair dye. Nancy, this is the 50s and I guess Yeah, it would have been by then. Early 50s
Joe Van Wie 51:10
I knew Blackie when I was a kid. I still remember when he was he was old. Yeah, I still saw punch someone in his 80s. Of Russell's
Tee Martin 51:19
That figures. Yeah. If I guess there was wonderful characters and the characters that I around the courthouse and be over. Jimmy Dixon, God bless him. He was a poor man. He was a paranoid schizophrenic and you know, always dressed as a very natty at one time, I guess he had a barber shop which he called his dance Oriole parlor cutting by appointment only and all but at this point in time is just a character on the courthouse. You know? Yeah, they were a straw boater in the summer and if you walk behind him and just pretended to blow on your hand he go into fits he said think it was the FBI and yeah, of course it is. It's always the poison powder and all this stuff. Guys like that came in. And then of course, you know there's Blackie and then the banana boys and be there. Yes.
Joe Van Wie 52:27
Tee Martin 52:28
Jeez. I loved it right. I love to spend time down there. Just watch the people you know. I'd love that I get free you know, free hamburger chocolate milk and all that good stuff.
Joe Van Wie 52:48
It's a socio economic climb to from the from your birth to the diner to East Grand Bellevue. It's like this little journey at the Walsh's Martin's or or gentle generation removed from immigration fighting to get get some stability in Scranton,
Tee Martin 53:08
yeah. Survive data. But you know, it would have been a very happy time. I should also mention that was adjacent to the Greyhound bus terminal. And why that place was interesting. Because they had a full luncheonette in there, and magazines and all kinds of stuff right for people. But upstairs was not giant horse room.
Joe Van Wie 53:40
What's the horse room? Like?
Tee Martin 53:44
They had to wire up there. They had the blackboards to track all the races. God's enemy right across.
Joe Van Wie 53:54
Tele the before television this is a way to bet on the horses. Yeah.
Tee Martin 53:59
Holy smokes. Sure.
Joe Van Wie 54:01
I would have never understood it because I've never heard anyone speak to it. Yeah, that's
Tee Martin 54:04
huge. Gambling is there. Across from the corridors. What a town.
Joe Van Wie 54:11
What a town when you describe scratch to me. I feel like I'm walking through a set a Hollywood set that I'll never see. No. Again.
Tee Martin 54:20
It was gambling was always an important part of the culture here as like, you know. And for a time I think it was during that time my mom was making book over forget one of my childhood traumas was when I quit button horses when I was 13. Okay, because I too, like other people in my family was always hustling and something. Yeah. If it was the summer time and my father was also in a cottage that belonged to my grandfather. We go up there in the summer. We spotted something I had to paper route up there. Back in Scranton, I had two paper routes at one time to Derby and n times in the afternoon and boden's a lake. I was go door to door selling things. I would pick berries. Yeah, in Salem, you know, I'll never forget I must have been 10 or 11. And I opened up to a trading post on the back porch and realize I had all kinds of stuff that I found and got an entrepreneur here and there Right? Yeah, I had pets for sale. I had turtles and I caught lizards and snakes whatever you wanted an easy trade to take money in I guess it all started with the firewood for a young lady but and the miraculous medals. But anyway, yeah, it was always something with me. So I had this money. And plus, on top of my money from the roots and all I had one so I'm kind of drawing at the old Mary Keller hospital used to be over it's outside. Up on the hill, it's outside force that no longer exists now. The way of both things a long time ago, but they had some kind of drawing over there and I'd won like 50 bucks there. So it was time for the Kentucky Derby. And we had a new television set. Right. We've gotten his TV set and you know so we're watching the race i i bet 100 hours on Hi John to win the Kentucky Derby so it's time for the race and my mom and I are watching the race on the course I got placed I was in tears practically it was like capital lib as he plays the is like oh god thinking perhaps I get a break there i Yeah. With my mother and she said all she said was you shall battle him across the board
by mistake now when I resume plan the horses much later in life after I got so I would always bet horse races three ways. was insane. Is it got a little crazy I had to stop
Joe Van Wie 58:00
T were you friends with Mike genteel people of Babel he loved the he's my horse man. He was always trying to tell tell me how
Tee Martin 58:09
well the way I encountered Bebo as a kid right? Because we would fight traditionally the Irish kids on nail but at least in my end of it right that's a much the kids at the other side of the aisle are up further whatever direction it is started. They were different kinds of people that were more like a Greenwich people
Joe Van Wie 58:34
yeah um yeah yeah, they
Tee Martin 58:36
really saw they weren't like involved with it but in my neighborhood Ramallah street down the Mulberry Street right. We go up usually up at the park or place we used to call Eagle Rock I guess in later days they had what was it reserves up there? Isn't that Yeah. Yeah. By Edwards
Joe Van Wie 59:05
Yeah, let me know OG Eagle Rock would be the National Guard had that. Yeah, whole block
Tee Martin 59:12
behind there. There were these cliffs and everything else. And we go up there and sometimes it was like a regular thing for long fire is on Saturdays and stuff. Right? You're up from school? We'd go up there. Right. And then in that Bunker Hill boys up there. Yeah. And they're all attacking kids. Right? And they went to like Prescott School and so forth. Right. And yeah, we'd have rock fights. Yeah, I have fights I'll never forget a little girl my maybe my first girlfriend right. Then what did you do but go like to the bell theater because every neighborhood in Scranton also had a movie theater. Yeah, I Yeah, every one of the The Hill Section there was to where were they? There was Park Theater between Mulberry and buying.
Joe Van Wie 1:00:06
There would have been the bingo hall. Yes. Yeah. That's a movie. All right. Yeah, that makes sense.
Tee Martin 1:00:11
Yes. A lot of movies. They're coming up. At one time I knew again he was a day an apartment in there. Yeah. And so we could sneak into the movies.
Joe Van Wie 1:00:24
And it wasn't like everyone had a television either that no movies were the draw if you're on
Tee Martin 1:00:30
TV was a big deal I ever forget Chuck Boyle at the first TV. On the block your block? Yeah. So you go over there. On the weekend or Friday night? Was it kids as a fight? Yeah, that was tragic night fights. Gillette. Yeah. Let's i Mother
Joe Van Wie 1:00:51
describes the event of Ned. Talk about grandfather's I wasn't allowed to call him grandfather or grandpa at all. We had to call them Ned. But he bought the first TV on their block and they would have the whole neighborhood over to watch television. While
Tee Martin 1:01:11
I was speaking and did that, like I said before, he was my hero. And God well, I have a lot in that Nadeau stories but the name thing like you just always net. Yeah. I had that same experience myself. Because after my son I was never dad. Or any of that stuff. I was always T. It's while I was always tea. It's a Walsh thing. It wasn't until I got sober. And my son finally asked me Can I call you dad now? Wow.
Joe Van Wie 1:02:08
We just talked about that. Do you think there was something maybe even with Ned as well? To not have the intimacy maybe that that restraint have
Tee Martin 1:02:21
always felt? I don't know. Like I'm nobody's dad. Yes, persona. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Cuz that's what it became a persona. So they invented
Joe Van Wie 1:02:35
the mask of the stage. And that's what I mean, what else can we be? It's really hard to find out. First, you have to find out your persona. Took me 43 years.
Tee Martin 1:02:44
Because around the same time, I'd gotten up TomorrowWorld for treatment. Yeah. And in a wouldn't let me say T.
Joe Van Wie 1:02:56
Really? No. And that was a clinical movie.
Tee Martin 1:03:00
I'll never forget. My first night there detoxifying. Right. That detox was the last 22 days. I spent most of my diamond detox there. But my very first night of course, your father appears that's scary. I couldn't believe it. I thought it was DTS. You're seeing Joe man we through withdrawals standing in the doorway, this room, I couldn't see his face. He's back lit by the hall. But he has a very distinctive voice because Oh, yeah. Right. Absolutely. And he says, you know, we've been waiting for you. It was like, I thought it was on the loose nation. I said Joe, because they know who was even. Joe, what the hell are you doing here? I got you too. I said, what happened? Gets like, Oh my God, I've been on the phone the mic. I guess. Not quite two years before that. Yeah, call me and everything. He was trying to sell all these automatic weapons. And I wanted to get a piece of the action. So I told him Joe, I'm gonna. I'm gonna call around and see what I can do. I'll get back to you. Yeah, and I did.
Joe Van Wie 1:04:28
Have I met my father was quite a bit of an entrepreneur. He was
Tee Martin 1:04:32
he was always, always even when we were silver. Up in the Poconos, he was always Solons.
Joe Van Wie 1:04:44
leather coats, jet tracksuits. My dad dictated my wardrobe once he was, I mean, he did another time another generation but he was good. He was an adventurer. He was a cowboy and A man needed adventure.
Tee Martin 1:05:01
Yeah, absolutely. We both did. That's why we went into the cigarette business in recovery. Yeah, I think at that point, we just wanted to prove ourselves. Maybe we still gotta do something. It was
Joe Van Wie 1:05:13
I think that was a, some kind of swan song or to prove you're an old but I just got out of treatment. I was 24 I might get this job. Good job back. I was at Xerox. And my dad calls me goes, well, you know, if you need to bridge some money, and you're gonna move back to New York, come down to Delaware drive this truck up to New York. I'm like, dad. He's telling you just to take one load up. You'll be fine. Right? Yeah, he's loved. Well, yeah, it was a tough. I didn't, I don't, I didn't understand my dad the way I understand them now. And a lot of that was because of you. You know, my dad's been passed two years now. And our last visit was really enlightening to me sitting talking to you, because how much I feel and respect you. And your relationship with my dad just gave me another insight to see a full character my dad, I wasn't able to see until I hear you talk about your friendship with him. And it. It's not leaving me empty. It just relieves me that I never had a full picture. Years friend. And I heard a different side of my dad, I didn't get to experience because I'm a son. And he was older. So I thank you for that, too. I mean, telling me these stories gives me the full picture of a guy I probably would have been friends with.
Tee Martin 1:06:43
We had a lot less gross. Things we left about we're probably horrify decent says
Joe Van Wie 1:06:53
laughing so called.
Tee Martin 1:06:54
But anyway. Yeah. The second thing he told me that night up there was I told these people all about you. It's all great. So now I got to go into some kind of group, right? And I introduce myself and all and they said I couldn't use my name. Wow, say that. What do you mean? I can't use my name. You have to call yourself, Tom. Is that I? Oh? My father. Is Tommy. I'm not. I won't you know, yeah. They said you got to do it. Because they said my name is associated with this street personal street
Joe Van Wie 1:07:48
persona of teep teep. Martin
Tee Martin 1:07:52
got it was tough. Yeah. But then I when I learned about and many stuff. Yeah. Then I Okay. I did it for 10 years in a while. I didn't know that. 10 years. My 10th anniversary, I told my own group in Jersey. I said, you know, I said I got the coin, you know, and all standing up there. I said, you know, I've been checking it all out for 10 years. So I think it's time I'm gonna trust you with my real name. It's a yet
Joe Van Wie 1:08:26
I didn't know that. Do you think that was an exercise just like a daily exercise in humility admitting that you you know, I'm gonna have a rebirth. Tea Tea for now. I'm going to table Tommy's this idea of recovery.
Tee Martin 1:08:43
Tom was just I'm just another time that three times and remaining that's me. Yeah. I mean, and you know how we do in AAA because so many of us have the same first name so it's always some kind of attach to it. Right. And I had a couple of things. I think one in the beginning. One of the earliest appellations I got was like Tommy gorilla cuz I used to talk about the gorilla my back it wasn't a monkey it was a gorilla. Yeah. Oh, God. Does that distinguish me from diesel Tom? It was a drunk who stole a train from where are you going with a train
Joe Van Wie 1:09:35
all the way man. The way it is no
Tee Martin 1:09:39
stop says claim to fame. That's your last gig. And there was three piece Tommy also was for peace. Oh, wow. Because he had one on his head too. We always wear a three piece suit. We're a piece on his head. My first bonds are really three Ps, your first sponsor had to pay. Yes. Did
Joe Van Wie 1:10:03
you ever speak to it?
Tee Martin 1:10:05
Like, no, he's ever since
Joe Van Wie 1:10:08
my generation ever even mentioned, that's a hard invite, like, I have to be conscripted now, visually to looking you in the eyes. When there's a thing on your head, you're selling his hair, like, am I supposed to now be conscripted into this illusion? Illusion?
Tee Martin 1:10:25
I don't know. But I got him as a sponsor, because they were after me. And that kept me going to after more work for a year and a half. Right. And I want to gel, the only guy adjusted since I was seven. I didn't know why he couldn't be my sponsor. The only guy I trust, why can't you be my sponsor? Of course, I didn't understand the conflict of interest thing. But he explained that to me, yeah, couldn't do it. And so I was so reluctant, because I couldn't take the time I left there. While I was mainly Joe. Yeah, there was a couple of guys that had been in my group. He had a group that was very special. It was the only one that was all men. Yeah. It was the junkyard dogs is what they call it, chose junkyard dogs. We're all kind of the same. Whatever you want to call our backgrounds, right? Well, you could, you know
Joe Van Wie 1:11:35
that. You guys were hard. There was some hard cases there,
Tee Martin 1:11:39
I guess. But you know, so there was a couple of those guys. Yeah. And trusted but no one like Joe, right. I told him things I'd never told anybody. The kind of things that drove me there. Ultimately, you know what I mean? I didn't go there to get sober. I went down to get out of my life. Yeah, I didn't run out of drugs. I had more than I could handle. It's I had this addiction thing. I was resigned to be an addict the rest of my life. And I thought I figured it out. I had several doctors write my scripts for oxycodone. I had other doctors write me scripts for Valium. And that was my medicine. I took that faithfully every morning. Yeah, cocaine boots. didn't count. That's a recreation.
Joe Van Wie 1:12:45
Tee Martin 1:12:47
I can always take a leave cocaine. I started taking a leave in 1962 when I stopped at 19. Stop taking Lehman 86
Joe Van Wie 1:13:00
I never met anyone. You were one of the first to say 1962 Cocaine. I don't you don't hear them in the same sentence a lot that didn't really emerge to you know, the rest of the population to like late 70s It started to be uncommon.
Tee Martin 1:13:17
The way I got involved with it was cuz I was happened now I'm from this guy green. And green was supposed to be like miles is connection. Because I was into this old you're living in New York now. I was in this whole scene. Starting to do a little reefer. Yeah. I had. I was in the process of separate myself from school. And when we only show up for them up in the burn
Joe Van Wie 1:13:48
for them. So you were in New York. This your 20s Right, you you're around a whole scene of beatniks Yes,
Tee Martin 1:13:55
yeah, exactly. I would go and hang in the village, you know, also because I had a Puerto Rican girl friends there, which is, like cliche. I actually met her at a dance in a gym. Wow. I was 17 in the village. No, no up in the Bronx. Wow. For him at the Bronx man. That was my girlfriend but wherever we went in the Bronx. I people in the boys they come out and they throw for beer bottles that are ads and stuff. You know, I'd be like, ripping off a car to keep fitting them away and stuff. And cops come and guess who got blamed?
Joe Van Wie 1:14:43
Tee Martin 1:14:47
But anyway, yeah. So yeah, I got the for the man. And so yeah, I was 17. At first I was limited in his motel. I right across from Fordham Fordham Road. And, you know, my father was still around. Yes. Anyway, my father and mother didn't think that was a good thing for me. I was 17 and crazy. They knew that was kind of funny thing man I got into for them. Because I gotten some poems published nationally. Yeah. That's why it wasn't any outstanding grades or any that kind of crap, right? We'll get into that. Talk about the high school years. But in any event, there I was. But here's the irony, right? No, I was probably a fully diagnoseable alcoholic by my senior year of high school. I kept wine in my locker and stuff. Anyway. I get there. So they know I guess they contacted the college is like, Don't you have any room at all and those dormitories and they didn't write, but they agreed to move me on to the campus. And my bed was in the infirmary. Now, the thing is, I'm in this I have a big room, I got eight beds, you know, and like nobody around. Because it's early in the semester. There's no patients in there. If they are, they come in for a boo boo during the day and get out, get whatever and at night. The place is all mine. So I'm in this big room, like empty Ward, right? At the end of the room is this big white cabinet with glass, you know, and the front and it's full of Turpan hydrate and Cody has like dying and going to have every time I go go downtown, right? I grabbed a train to get down to the village and then drink one have a little cocktail on the train. Because people didn't bust your balls in those days. You could drink outside and stuff in New York. Yeah, but he cared. Right? Nobody cared
Joe Van Wie 1:17:28
someone in the street does everyone keep their their eyes straight?
Tee Martin 1:17:32
Yeah. Because we used to drink in Washington Square Park so I didn't drink the way the other guys did they like to go to college bars by the school in the web and post cozy note all these college places right? I bet in them once or twice but it was always jump on the Third Avenue well and go downtown. And even the way I drank downtown it was like I like to drink with the White House. Yeah Park get off the train and get like a gallon and a half a gallon wine cheap wine. Go over to the park. It was magically popular. I talk to these old dudes, man. And then maybe I get loaded and I go down to like the cafe. Why? Yeah, if I got down there early enough dad the open mic. You call it these days? Would you do some beat or? Yeah, did read some poetry and we all share the bass. Wow. Yeah, man. One day in there as I did first, while they were just checking, trying their act out. Peter, Paul and Mary. But that's when the invasion is focusing or started happening right
Joe Van Wie 1:18:57
in the village. Right? Yeah, like Bob Dylan music used to be
Tee Martin 1:19:01
you know, like, Bongo drummers, conga drummers and stuff like that jazz, you know? And started shift and all these people guitar showed up. And one of them was this Heck, he comes in one day, and he's gonna get a cut to the basket. See? That's when I'm watching how many people are gonna be at them? Like, because it's gonna determine how much I get. Yeah. And so. Yeah, so this guy shows up and he's singing I can't understand the word. He's saying. It sounds like hillbilly music to me, right. I was like, what was this guy saying? And I'm buying my Haiwan they're getting an album. first album was a Oh, yeah. Oh, that's what he was.
Joe Van Wie 1:20:00
that pic that T is referring to is Bob Dylan in the title. Bob Dylan is the debut studio album by American singer songwriter Bob Dylan, released on March 19 1962. By Columbia Records. The album was produced by a Columbia talent scout, John H. Hammond, when earliest signed Dylan to the label, and decision, which was at the time controversial. Now, two years later from that, Dylan has a release of a song called Mr. Tambourine Man, which we're about to hear tea discuss. There's been many interpretations of what this song could possibly mean. And one being while there is speculation the song is about drugs, particularly the lines as take me on a trip upon your magic swirling ship, and the smoke rings of my mind. Dylan has denied the song. It's about drugs. Though he was smoking marijuana at the time the song was written Dylan was not introduced to LSD until a few months later. But there is questions about methamphetamines outside of the drug speculation the song has been interpreted as a call to the singer spirit or muse, or as a search for transcendence. Well, T has a different story, and I believe my cousin, and we'll hear about T 's tambourine. And what how he played it
Tee Martin 1:21:35
Oh, that was buddy.
Joe Van Wie 1:21:39
That way that was Bob Dylan.
Tee Martin 1:21:41
Oh, yeah. And then I'd see him around. Yeah,
Joe Van Wie 1:21:45
yeah, he stayed around for a while.
Tee Martin 1:21:49
If I was who he was talking about, because there was a point in time when I was living down there, right. Finally, I'd go around and I always had a flight bag. On my shoulder where I kept stuff. Yeah. By then I was doing lots of speed. Yeah. And so when I walked in, I kept the tambourine in so when I was being bringing rain and ideal and speed, yeah, far right. So I've been wondered about that song. Yeah. Because he went through a phase with all that shit.
Joe Van Wie 1:22:38
Yeah, I seem so
Tee Martin 1:22:40
scared. I used to hang around with John Savage. You know at one point in time as you know, positively Fourth Street, right? was about John Collette a character. He and I used to take people off you us and then when I lived in Brooklyn, he used to come over there to get me scores and stuff like that. Yeah, was he know I had a script for desoxyn What's desoxyn methamphetamine 10 milligram tablets is that I have this they were really hard I just mentioned where they ever turn in these chips and I put the chips in water. Put them in a vial let them stand for a while to water turns like radioactive yellow. Yeah, shoot that stuff. These rituals anyway, I was dying to tell you so and then lighter note I guess for whatever album that Fourth Street was positively Fourth Street or something who refers to savage rose and fixable. Guest John
Joe Van Wie 1:24:05
Tee Martin 1:24:05
Yeah. He was crazy. One time you went we really want to go uptown. We're gonna we're gonna like brace the Mamas and the Papas. Because Jan Phillips out of money. It was like crazy. It's like where are we going man? It's like cuz you know, these big knives and we used to wear a sheep knives on our belts is that it's legal. You could walk around New York on those things. I didn't see why everybody didn't do it. But we did. So, all the way up in Midtown, they were in some motel or hotel there. This is crazy. We are strange looking guy.
Joe Van Wie 1:24:57
Tee Martin 1:24:58
I always wear a Blu ray Yeah jam where this Russian had all the time he was an older guy he was a Korean War vet. And he kind of a handlebar mustache and the knife and God is obviously speed freaks central casting and pirates knows me money.
Joe Van Wie 1:25:20
Go time down the Mamas and the Papas.
Tee Martin 1:25:24
No. I think we did get kicked out in the lobby. That's a spice we were your people. But yeah, he went through that phase.
Joe Van Wie 1:25:43
To at what point? does it relate to this? One time? You told me about the first attempt at look like how our help like social care before rehabs or rehabs in the sense for just straight addicts. Oh, you found some house where you can dry out like where is that and contact.
Tee Martin 1:26:07
The guys in the eighth precinct found it for me. One day happened was I was living in Brooklyn. When I finally I had already quit school and everything right? Yeah. And of course, I was living with another guy from Scranton. He was also at Fordham, except he finished. I got to the point where I was only showing up for exams. Yeah, I would get the books. If I got my hands on the books. You know, I chewed some math. Basically back then at 25 milligram ampules. They used to call them bomb beers. And so I bang a bomb beat. I'd read like all of medieval history, and one night, I go into some room and regurgitate all this stuff on the blue books. God knows what I wrote. It was just crazy, you know? And then me to go drink because it's like it's it's like, this morning, and it's like time, you know? Oh, my God, lead to more blackouts and poison hangovers. Anyway. We decided we had to get out of the Bronx anyway, because we got involved in some crazy stuff that two of us mean buzz, you know? By now I discovered heroin. And it was a cure for alcoholism. Yeah. I didn't drink. Every other drug I drank with Banette heroin. I knew where I was going to be. You know, I often have shares in a you know, other respect. You know, I learned how to respect those conditions and stuff. resides I'm only gonna mention this once. In terms of dry goods, I said, But I discovered a cure for alcoholism when I was 18 years old. I said the AMA still refuses to acknowledge this. I said. I said it was called heroin. Yeah. And all I have to say is if you're gonna make your life more manageable than booze, you reflect on alcoholic. Yeah. Can I say that? Yeah.
Joe Van Wie 1:28:33
Yeah, this is HBO. It's a podcast. It's pirate radio again,
Tee Martin 1:28:38
do know, because I can't help myself sometimes with shit. Anyway. Yeah. So getting back to whatever the hell we're talking about. These guys you get don't you get pinched. My mind goes all over the place. Oh, yeah.
Joe Van Wie 1:28:55
I if I can remember this thing? Yeah, yeah. So
Tee Martin 1:28:59
here's the deal. Now I bent out of some hospital. And that's why buzzin I had to get out of the Bronx. Because one night, right down the village. I'm with this guy who is a lifelong friends and he's gone. Of course. Russell, right. Oh, God has such a long story. I'm old. But it's see what we got in the habit of doing once I turned 18 Right. Yeah. And so it was a thing. You know, so by this time I'm hanging out with my friends Joel. They rustle in we're hanging out on the Upper West Side right with these guys sometimes. Except it's hard. I can't bring Bakey up there my girlfriend cuz more assholes, right? All Irish guys. Anyway. Oh my God, that's another story stories after story anyway. We go up to Columbia Presbyterian Hospital every two weeks and you give blood and you're pathogenic be 18. Yeah. And we got, I think we got like $20 It's 1960. Man, the average dude like the minimum wage, just make it $40 A week? Yeah. Which is the thing that attracted me into selling drugs. You know, I thought I knew everything and had everything figured out. But that's something else. But at that time, I wasn't using heroin. But we would go up and we go right across the street from Columbia Presbyterian. I'll never forget it, there was a place called the tropical gardens bar. And in the daytime, they had to furs to fish. So we go over there. And we go into japa go gardens, right, and start banging these two fingers down to for the price of one. And our blood level, or whatever that is that part of it was like, way down low, right? We'd always decline the juice that we were offered. We got something else. So we go over that and now we'd be pretty well hammered. And then we drink our way all the way down Broadway back to the neighborhood, right? Which was at that time. The upper west 80s. From 86 to 90. On Amsterdam Avenue. It's where we hang out. We're uptown, right? So this one night, we do the thing. And we drink on our way down Broadway. We're walking past Columbia University. Right. So Joe's, do you know there's a bar in here? So why? You said yeah, they got a bar here. And it's called the lion's den. It's a Rathskeller. He said there's no booze, but it's beer. Right? We should check it out. Maybe we can pick up some chicks from Barnard. Right and possibly get laid? Because the Irish Catholic girls in the Bronx. Yeah, we're like, oh, we're in virgin pins and so forth. And besides, they weren't my kind now, I had my girlfriend anyway, Vicki until I gave her appetizers and sent her back to Puerto Rico. Never liked me. Her brother belonged to this gang called Social lords. Over Long Island City.
Joe Van Wie 1:33:06
Is this like a predecessor before the kings like this be the 60s Right?
Tee Martin 1:33:10
Oh, yeah, sure. Anyway, so there we are. So we're gonna go in and meet these chicks from born on all these illusions we had. Anyway, we go into this place and we got some beer. Now. I'm sitting down with some chick from Barna. We did they're they're actually zipped it girls, right? I'm telling them I'm a writer. Yeah. What are your right? I was just telling her I said, I write the dictionary. I'm still on A's. I said, some line of bullshit, right? And all of a sudden they have a dance contest. Yeah, it's gonna be a dance contest. Well, I was always a good dancer. I learned to do two things as an adolescent. The most important things I learned to do were dance and fight. Yeah, right. That's why these fingers are all Yeah. Anyway. Sure enough, so the guy is buzzing. And Joel has told me go on. Come on. The contest way entered the contest. And sure as hell, I think it was a twist contest, right? Because that was a hot number. Then. I got a whole story about all that too. And a pepper Malone's in the madness that went on there. But anyway. I win the contest. Yeah, it's great. Oh, now, the prize is 20. And some kind of record which I immediately turn into a frisbee and we split. Right. So we're back down on Broadway. We're going downtown and Joe's saying what are you going to do with the money He said, I don't know. I know what I do if I had $20 I said, I'm not getting no Hawker. I know what you would do. I said, I'm not doing that. He said, No, that's not what I'm talking about. He said, if I did $20 I get some dope. Is it really? You said, yeah. Well, I had been on my to do list. Yeah. That's all the to do list. And so we got back down to the neighborhood. We went over to Columbus Avenue, because back then it was the days in needle Park. And I so while behind the Museum of Natural History, neighborhood, it's all gentrifying. Yeah. Because your million dollars to look at a place anyway. That whole area Columbus Avenue was SROs. Those big old buildings. Yeah. Right. They were all zeros, or they were explored tenements. Right? And so yeah, and that's when I met Rasul. Because Rosa was already adept, dope fiend. And I did it for the first time. And that was it. No. I was. I was like, I was a little afraid. I wanted to skin it. We went up to this crazy guy's place, Larry Harris. He lived with his parents in a sixth street. Sixth Street. And we went up, asked him was anybody home so we go in. And we're at Larry's place and you know, everybody's gonna fix. I was gonna scan it. And then Joe said, not gonna mean my mind. So I did, too. It was unlike anything I've ever experienced. Of course. Yeah. It's crazy. Because right off the bat, I was sick. But I wasn't sick. It just threw up. I wasn't sick. You know, I got really wasted. We went back down to Broadway and got James good down village.
Or forget it. I got a Coca Cola some pizza stand on the way and drank it. And it was crazy. I spit that up, too. But the weird thing was it tasted like so gone down the days of like, so coming up. Like, wow, this is really crazy. Don't forget again. I was not in it. For some reason. I was seeing cows. Why black and white cows and crazy stuff. Right? My eyes closed. The dream was arrived to me and now. Yeah. And that precipitated why Oh, my God, run until I was well, they stop using IV drugs. See the end of seventh unit early? That's when I went and made progress of my own design. Yeah. But getting back to the other thing, right. So the reason we had to get out of the Bronx was because ridin a village one night, it was a bunch of pus. It was me. Joel Russell was Jack so he's five again, Emmett? 02. So we go up in some guy's place on Bleecker Street. Going up into his apartment, and it's crazy. Larry Harris is the same guy whose apartment I first used. And he's telling us like, do you really want to get fucked up? Say no more. Yeah. What are you talking about? He said, Well, if you go over the Third Avenue to kills for mercy, you can get this stuff. It's called Dr. Smith as mentor. And if you drink it, you will really get fuck off. So naturally, somebody ran over the gills pharmacy and bought a bunch of this green stuff as my door is green flaky powder look like they ship the grim. Yeah, the janitor puts on the floor when you're good. Have you done school? Yeah, I guess it was so nice, right? Yeah, it looks like that. So when you had the water, I had a big tumbler the stuff I felt like Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde, right? I put the shit in and starts foaming. This green is green liquid, and we all drank it. Oh my god. As soon as I drank it. I remember all I remember it was real hot. real hot. My face was real hot. And I fell on the floor. And what I thought happened then, it seemed when I fell on the floor. A shelf broke on the wall. It was full of Campbell's Soup Cans. Every one of them came down and hit me in the back and the next thing I know, it was a couple days later when I opened my eyes again, I had no conscious memory from that point on. I was in for poor restraints. hospital bed back in the Bronx. It was in fourth hospital I had no idea where I was. All I knew is that I came out of this coma or whatever you want to call it. Because the nurse was giving me some kind of shot as soon as I did. Right now I see the nurse I see the shot I'm looking around where the hell am I? And Jesus you're awake. I've got to go tell them and leaves i don't know I'm in this ward. I don't even know what hospital is at this point. And everything and next thing I know these cops come through cops come up for port restraints they can see my alarms so after bad busted, you know, I guess from that point as well. I became a registered heroin addict in New York State are registered. I used to do that. Oh god tea, you know. Anyway, these cops started asking me all these questions. Say What the hell did you guys do? See we didn't do anything. What are you doing? I didn't do anything. Now what was that? What was what stuff were you guys take a sec. I don't know anything you know? And I and then he finally tells me the one cop says if you don't tell him. Here's what I gotta tell you. He said your friend Russell Stevens is in an oxygen tank. And at Roosevelt Hospital. If he dies, guns judge you with manslaughter xat so I told the story I said all I know is I was in the village. This environment I Bleecker Street I drink this stuff. I told them Dr. Smith's asthma door. Right? I just told them what happened right? So they quickly left them because apparently what happened was I wound up uptown what happened was I fell on my face. It was funny because to where when guys, myself and rasa. Add this kind of catatonic really, you know reaction to this stuff. So I learned later by what I thought were Sam Campbell's Soup Cans hitting my head are those guys and they're all starting to feel this. They're getting crazy too. Right? dragging me down the steps in my head and all those steps going down the street guy laying on the sidewalk on Bleecker Street now they're all fighting with each other about what are we gonna do what are we gonna do we got we got him land here. I don't know what are we going to anyway apparently Emmett and Lowry have Larry had a car maybe did one that put me in a car and they drove me back up to the Bronx because No buzzin I should mention, we live in off campus. After the first year we had a little place on Loring place up in the Bronx, this basement apartment in the rear was collect something in of itself behind the boiler. Like really defined this was very difficult. But anyway apparently they drove all the way up there to the place the Bronx in a way and it's starting to go crazy, right? So sometimes when he get crazy with take off his clothes, so apparently he ripped off his clothes in the car, he was punching the ceiling and all this crazy stuff starting to feel is he I get wild Nene. I agree. It was a crazy guy. Stories edge just crazy. Did all kinds of things. He jumped in nods and river one time we're dragging down a riboside Bock that we're running along in the park. Watching them go downstream. Thank you police lunch came out in the 70s and
Joe Van Wie 1:46:15
there wasn't much of a clean river then you can check him out at
Tee Martin 1:46:19
the marina. And he's he was pretending to be a Russian seaman. And he was Bill litical asylum. And he got his island that time they put him in Bellevue for three days and back to Bellevue. Anyway. Yeah, it's kind of prophetic. It's like I started in Bellevue, and then I went up there, but I was later but so yeah, this whole crazy thing happens. So I didn't know what to do. You know, I was in there. Right? I'm in Florida Hospital. Russell's at Roosevelt Hospital. Was was on a train going uptown now between 59th street and on a 25th street. There's no stop. It's an Express. So somewhere in that stretch, he's started trying to open the doors and get out of the drain. I'll get screaming. This is my stop. This is my stop. So when the train got 220/5 Street, the transit cabs are waiting for him. He starts fighting with them. And they beat him down. Take him to Harlem Hospital. By the time he gets there. He's got concussion. But he's so crazy at Harlem Hospital. They take send him down the Bellevue amot made it back to his parents place. That's a whole life story. Mr. Khan, but anyway, his dad was a real character right off the boat. But so he's there. On the edge of his bed screaming about these green men is Rome and all this stuff. So they call the cops they took him to Bellevue for the second time.
Joe Van Wie 1:48:10
This is all from key the results of keells pharmacies, Doctor
Tee Martin 1:48:14
Dr. Smith's Esmond. Don't What the hell is it? I found out later I looked up the ingredients is Stramonium and Bella Donna.
Joe Van Wie 1:48:24
Oh, Bella Donna. That's Nightshade. Yes,
Tee Martin 1:48:27
yeah. Deadly Nightshade used by witches in the Middle Ages is madness and death. It caused a to madness and
Joe Van Wie 1:48:36
madness and death and Alcoholics Anonymous. That was what Bill was treated with a town toss was the years
Tee Martin 1:48:43
were occasions Yes, he was under that
Joe Van Wie 1:48:47
treatment, which produced that white tunnel effect and high dosage that loosened the hallucination that most people is common to that bell. Adonis is a wind tunnel effect and the death of an ego. I think that coupled with the Oxford groups helped him find his way to design the steps. I really do believe that. That sounds
Tee Martin 1:49:09
make sense. Yeah, sure. It does. Yeah, I found that out later.
Joe Van Wie 1:49:15
Wow. That's that's a nasty stuff.
Tee Martin 1:49:18
Now you gotta Joel and Jack Yeah. They wound up eating out their families were notified. Yeah, because they're in town. Right. So they go gotta get them. They were at St. Vincent's Hospital. Over on Seventh Avenue. He just Bradshaw and they had the boys at the end of a quarter tied down restrained in wheelchairs, because all they were doing was screaming. Yeah. They were just sitting there screaming when their families came to get them. So what did we hit? We did like 12345. different hospitals that's why within a very short period of time that's why the cops were very curious Yeah, so yeah so what happened with me was next thing I know some guy maybe a shrink i don't know some kind of doctor he's got interns he's somebody with them right so this studying me this standing around the bed the best to shape right but he's still kind of my arms and he's starting to say things like oh do you use this do this with other boys Oh, I can make an insinuations between my drug use and possibly homosexuality or whatever
Joe Van Wie 1:50:47
all being discouraged back then some kind of relation Yeah, you know
Tee Martin 1:50:51
and I got pissed off. So what are you trying to say man? Yeah, because I what he's trying to say is that maybe you got a problem I said look at that tire wear and stuff like that and then he got pissed off. Next thing I know, taken me away. Take me over the Jacoby hospital to put me in a mental ward there. So for some reason, right? So no, I'm in an ambulance. I go over to Jacoby which is way the hell up Pelham Parkway. Right. These hospital togs that they gave out like scrubs. Somebody sits me on a bench. And they're going to see somebody about admitting me this like unit. So I split. So now I'm out on the street. It's not warm weather. It's not summer by any stretch. And now all I can do is I got money from somebody on the street so I can get to a phone booth. So I call this guy I knew from Fordham. Oh, had a car. Like I said, I need arise, said where are you? What's going on? I didn't see buzz today, either. All the stuff. I said now I guess you wouldn't. I said I don't know. We did this crazy shit. And we all want in the hospital. I guess I don't know where he is. Anyway, I need a ride. I'm stuck in these pajamas. And I got no way home. Take me home. So Mike came up and picked me up. And he took me back to the apart. Loring, place. What happened though, was Emmett and Larry drove me up there, but when they did, they just dragged me because I was in ours. Yeah, into the hallway on the first floor and they kicked down the SuperS door basically. And split. So the cops game. Yeah. And the ambulance and all that. And that's how I wound up at the hospital. So when I got back to the apartment, I had a note there from the landlady saying this detective wanted to see me. Boy, all this crap. So I, you know, I just figured it was time for us to get the hell out of there. I never went to see him. But we split and moved to Brooklyn. Yeah. We had a great crazy place there. Many stories about 363 60. Washington. But anyway, after I moved to Brooklyn, by now I'm totally entered to all dope thing. Right. And as it turned out, many things went until it got to the point in Brooklyn, I Vicki had been sent back because of the hepatitis they disappeared, or in Puerto Rico somewhere. I never saw her again. But in the meantime, I hooked up with this gal, a student from Pratt, studying painting, Jane, and we're living together at 360, Washington. And and also what has happened in the meantime was hanging out in the neighborhood. No, no, I had Newport News, Sally desconto. And our Sally black, you know, so I got friendly with this whole crew Guys, they're in Brooklyn from Myrtle Avenue. And I was crazy how that happened. I it was a bar they all used to go to from pride on DeKalb Avenue. Everybody in the neighborhood went there to drink and was in there one night. And I was staring at this woman at the end at a bar. Right. Next thing I know. She's looking back. Now all I do is stare and just sitting at the opposite corner of the bar by the street door.
And next thing I know she sends me a drink. So she sends me a drink we went up to like,
that's how I met wash. But Marsha was the girlfriend of this guy. Little gel from where I live. Anyway, I was going home with her later I was going to live with her for over over a period of five years in Manhattan so at that time, I was bouncing between maj and Jane for a while until J moved in with me. But in the meantime, Sally and I were fooling around with these two women, black women they had naturals back then nobody had these things. I short, natural hair cuts. Yeah. And they they were a mother and daughter but they look like twins. Unless you got up close Carmen and one. A Carmen as it turned out was a South American singing contract and all this yet. So Sally got involved with her. I spent one night with one. But we were still we were just hanging out. Right. So event. The other thing with Karma one is they also fooled around with these young cops in the neighborhood. They were very friendly with them and socialize with these cops. So they would tell us things. But listen, they told us you guys should call it all that kind of stuff. We couldn't. couldn't call it. During that period. I had an intervention one time. Really? Yeah. Wasn't that look like wasn't your ordinary intervention. I was looking for this guy, Carmine the Sicilian. Because he fucking he came over my house. We got off. I lived on the third floor. So I didn't know it. When he left my place. He robbed everybody in the building. Went to every jar. stuck them up. Son of a bitch. Now everybody in the building's coming to me. Yeah, right. And complaining naturally your guess people live. They're nice people. You know. I was pissed. So I spent some time walking up and down Myrtle Avenue. I went down to Fort Greene Park everywhere where this guy couldn't find him. So one of the places and Sally attended bar there for a while. This guy got fat Ricky, at this bar yells at a junkyard and another bar in Brooklyn called a wigwam, which was all Indians, Native Americans, right? All the steelworkers. Oh, yeah, he lived in that neighborhood. And they all went to the wigwam that was a crazy place. Anyway, did this was the other place at Myrtle Avenue, right? So I go in there. I sit down. sitting at a table I forget who I was talking to it the table, right? So who shows up but Carmine I'm sitting down at the table. So I got my knife on the table. He's got all these keys and crap in his hand dry is I understand you're looking for me. I said yeah, I'm looking for you. You fuck. I said you wrapped everybody in the building. Yeah, thanks. Yeah, no. I said what the hell? Yeah, bring all this heat on me. And he said, Yeah, yeah, well, I'll send you a postcard when you're right because No, and we're about to get it on. If that Ricky comes over and he's got this sawed off shotgun sales go our mind, you know, get the fuck out of here and don't come back. I started to get up to leave. He said now you can't remind us is over At the end of the bar, right? So I'm sitting at the end of the bar he says it stood right next to me with the shack, his lap. And he says, What the fuck is wrong with you, guy? You, Sally. I get dressed Sally anymore. You put that Bob banya in your arms around with the negatives in the specs. He says What the fuck is the matter with you? He says shorty make him a wine cooler. Guy brings me a wine cooler. It says drink it.
I'm drinking my wine cooler. That's when he makes this speech to me. Right? As me how is that? Like? Oh, yeah, it's good. Yes. Go Draghi uses Wi Fi fuck, and you just come to the bar and drink a wine cooler and act like a civilized human being. Yeah. That led to another story. But I won't go into that now. But it was crazy. Because he used to call me artiste. Yeah, because they were the Baray. Right the brand. So he wants to commissioning me after that, is I'm gonna give you a job. I want you to fix up the like a ballroom next door, right? And when used in years, he says I want you to fix it up decorator do something do something because we're going to have this dance. And I hired this band guitar Crusher. So I don't know what the hell I'm doing. So I go over by Pratt to yard supply place I get this paint. I paint the fluorescent lights in there. I get on the ladder. I paint all these lights, different colors and stuff, right? I don't know why I'm doing but he's giving me money to do this. So naturally. Right. So I think I'm finished. So I think it was in another day or two days. Not kind of in the very next day. They have this dance that night, which was very cool to get dark crush. It was quite a blues guy. He played Europe and everything. Anyways, musics great. And it was a great neighborhood dance because it was such a mixed neighborhood. So yeah, the black people were there. The Puerto Ricans were there. I mean, all the Italian dudes from a gangster type team from Scranton, and me, right. And so I'm having a ball. And then I noticed something. I use the water based paint on lights out now. And it's starting to drip down onto people's clothes. So I got the hell I get to enjoy the dance after all. But nothing was said I didn't hear about it later. But there were no further Commission's coming from fat Ricky. Crazy times. So anyway, we're known to these cops, right? Yeah. Through Carmen and Juan and everything. We used to like it was a different world. So they would eat in gases. And that's where we ate to the Greek lunch on DeKalb Avenue, right. So we same place at that time thing going on plainclothes cops in taxi cabs. Yeah. So we had a lot of fun with that. I remember buzzy one day,
Joe Van Wie 2:03:48
Tee Martin 2:03:51
the guy's cab is parked there at the COP. He's in there Eat up. This old man is trying to get downtown right. He's going downtown. I forget what the hell he was up to. It's been buzzed. I was rapping to him. Tell him something about getting the shoe shrunk. You can get your shoe Shrike. I did all this stuff downtown. I came up with anyway we wanted to send him the guy in I said well, the cab drivers right inside going. He won't mind. Yeah, just tell them you want the gap. And so we do things like gonna get your shoe shrunk, just busted jobs. But then at one time they had buzzy Sally's place on the surveillance from across the street. And it was it must have been kind of funny because the one afternoon we all meet buzz and sell dropped acid. Yeah. And we were out of our minds in this front apartment. Right? This surveillance is going on we find out later. And it was crazy because we all tore our clothes off. We were throwing every object It was something about objects into the center of the room and a big pile, the stereo buzzy through his glasses know what he was trying to eat his glasses at once. And we're native and pushing everything in every object for some reason, having be centered, it was all unnecessary material objects were no longer relevant, but them in a big pile. Fire
Joe Van Wie 2:05:27
was coming face to
Tee Martin 2:05:31
face later I was thinking oh my god, they saw this
Joe Van Wie 2:05:34
with Sal connect it at that time or made a no no, no, nothing like
Tee Martin 2:05:41
nah, it's just a regular guy you want to. But anyway, so here's how this thing came about. Now. I've been in hospitals with overdoses in St. Vincent's, and so forth in and out with drug related stuff. But they've been given us all kinds of warning. Yeah, I went down Eric's one time and I used to be able to cash checks there or whatever. You know, because Marsha could that's how I got into that privilege. And it was a regular object. And Barton it says to me says I can't take your money. And that has happened twice. Guys from the eighth. One time we got in a fight in AI, some kind of frat guys from Pratt, and we beat the shit out. Because we were in there with Carmen and Juana and why Carmine was joking around you put a chicken bone in? Who knows? You know? He had the natural Eric gotten off. And we were just goofing right? It was me and Sally, couple other guys from her lab. And when these guys started throwing cigarette butts over at us. So we there was a good old fashioned barroom brawl. Anyway, I even lost one shoe that I kicked in this too. Anyway. Good time was had by all you know, but I guess we broke some arms or something. So when I went back to the block, the next time Jack tells me says the guys from the ADA Duran. And they said you better lay low. Don't be in there. I didn't know where to find with. Yeah, but to give me a tip, you know? Yeah. Second time. When I waited, it was taking your money. And you and Sally can't drink anymore. Because the guys from the aviate were told me you guys are dealing drugs. You don't want a chicken here. So another one. But what can you do? You know. So I continued then when I got roasted, I was 30. They got me verzi W, just a small amount of heroin. That's it. But they gave me at this station right to the precinct, which was just a couple blocks from where I live two blocks away. And these guys, because they knew me, said, Listen, you can put these judges in the drawer, right? Because frankly, I don't feel like going to court with your ass on a day off, you know? Or you could pick up this phone. They just had an article in the Daily News. I think it was only a week or two before that. I remember. What had happened was the New York State Department of Corrections and probation hired guys from Cinna see the only place I'd say the federal prison hospitals in Lexington, Kentucky. In Fort Worth, Texas. Right. Where Delphine could get help was out in Santa Monica at sin want to send an on set sin was a house yeah, on the beach in Santa Monica. It was a guy Chuck Diedrich. He was yeah recovering alcoholic and he used to like to hang out on appearance and or Mike right. So what happened hanging on the pier to drink a cup coffee whatever. He befriended these dopey. Yeah, and they would talk to me and everything. And we bring them back to the house. A we have what he called symposiums. But these guys couldn't pronounce the word. So then they get to ask him is like, are you gonna have one of those things? Again, there was that, you know, I guess what he was doing was like meetings with these guys.
So eventually, it turned into the first place outside of those two hospitals since 1939. Where they were trading, if you will. Well, it was the therapeutic community, right? Yeah. which later became a criminal. blossomed over the years into a terrible criminal organization. Yeah. At that point in time. No. It was the only thing and I remember guys went there. A guy had stand 360, Washington, his family came and took them to sin. So after became established, Eva made a movie about it. In 1960, I think about sin, it was called sin. Yeah. They also had a great band.
Joe Van Wie 2:11:11
This is before na to write. And really developed No,
Tee Martin 2:11:16
well, it started in 53. Yeah. But it was just as still rather disorganized at 60. For example, we couldn't have an NA meeting in New York because of the Rockefeller laws. Yeah. Also, the thing I mentioned about the registration of addicts is like, if two or more of you technically work together as a crime, it could be a felony violation of probation. That's scary. And you could get run in for that. Anyway. Oh, yeah. Well, but let me just finish this. Yeah. So now, they started something that was almost a replica of sin. Except it was an princes Bay instead now. I called it data, drug addicts yield to treatment on probation and parole.
Joe Van Wie 2:12:13
What was name?
Tee Martin 2:12:15
Was the judge in the names center for criminal addicts. So they said, You got to call this place. Or else we follow through with all this stuff. Go we can forget about it. So I had to call from the precinct. So yeah. As I said, the you adult feed I said, Well, I got to have a nap. I said, Yeah, we're all don't freeze out here. So you don't use tonight. If you do, we're gonna know. And you get out here by 10 o'clock tomorrow morning. Okay, so I go back and I tell Jane, and she says, Oh, is this part of it too? Because she was already disgruntled. My friend Doug from upstairs told me because he was living in the apartment I used to have to I move in the second floor with Jane says this girl came to New York to be an artist, you know? And then she moved in with you because she was wants to live with you. Not your CRO. Yeah. I always had this attitude that loosens me you know? And he says she doesn't want to live with Sally black and skinny Blackie and Georgie is a Greek and Sabu and all these characters you always have here. Like I say she was already a little upset with me. But then she said oh, is this part of until I wait around for you to get on these kinds of places? Yeah, was the last thing she said to me. And it's what took me eventually but yeah, so I go to this place. Like take the train over man I take the ferry that's all I knew was the ferry used to be a cheap date was like a nickel is six back and a girl you ride the ferry back and forth. It's nice. Anyway. I didn't know Staten Island was so big. I got off I had to directions. I gotta take this bus. It was like where am I is back then it wasn't all settled. It was green fields. I went past and stuff. I finally am at the end of the line. I gotta walk to other blocks to get to the place. I get out there. There's a picket line. All these angry people from Staten Island, you know, not my backyard. It's like addicts Get out while I was go home. I had They were pierced or at the yellow. So I gotta crawl through this, like, protest. And I was good tonight before all I did was some lip brims, I think. And I smoked ash. The kids stay cool. So now by the time I'm out there, I'm starting to go on withdrawal, right? So I go in, there's a woman who has a desk. So walk over, I tell them I'm here, says, Oh, that's good to have a seat on the bench and I'll be with you. I sat on that bench and sat and sat down, I got my handkerchief off. I'm wiping my face is like, my nose is starting to run. Finally, finally, she says they'll see you now. Sorry, go through the door next to the desk. I expect I'm gonna sit down with somebody right now. And they're gonna ask me questions now. Six or seven guys standing around this room. And they start firing things at yelling at you right off the bat. It's like the first thing was What are you a pimp? So what are you talking? Now, I am not a pimp. Take out those dope fiend sunglasses. I to this day these days because it wasn't funny that I was so insulted. They thought I was a pimp. But here's the thing. The dope fiends and glasses were little around blue sunglasses. Right. I had a blue shirt. Dark blue shirt. A light blue denim Sparco blow what we used to call dat the skinny pants with slash pockets. I am wearing blue suede shoes. I'm smoking Gaulois cigarettes. Were during the blue pack. I was in this kick of blue.
Am I a pimp? I said no, I'm not a pimp. Wow. Now, if I can dope boisar You a dope fiend. guy yells at me. I said no. I'm not. As user quaintly pushes the dope fee. I said, I got heroin habit. I need to kick it. He said then you're a Delphi. And we went back and forth on that subject for a while. And finally, okay, I'm adult feed. And then the next thing was, what do you want here? I told you guys, you know, I'm still going to get this arrow now. But I gotta get in. They made me come out here from a precinct, you know. I mean, if I don't do this, they're gonna follow through and press these charges on me, et cetera, et cetera. It's like now now. What do you do? And finally, it got to the point where I finally clicked. It's like, I need help, though. Yeah, I need to ask him for it. And then when I did finally it was yes. I'm Adelphia. And I need help. I want to help. It was I can't hear. Can you hear a knock and I go through this whole ritual am with me. And finally I was screaming at the top of my lungs, I'm hoping I need and then they all cracked up and came over and hugged me and welcome back to the house. We left the room went back outside and they said, you don't get a bed till you're done kick. You can be on the couch over there. As long as you need to be there. Somebody's down at this desk all night long. You know, they'll massage your legs when you got the cramps. whip you up, you know, an agnostic in the kitchen. And so there you have it. So I spent about 90 hours on x, which is I guess my habit was worse than I thought, you know? Yeah. And when I was done I couldn't wait. I just wanted to lay down right. So now they take me upstairs. They assigned me a room These three other guys who was Bansal like jailed I foreign row. I'm all settling down. So now, you got to work. You're on the maintenance crew. So here I am. After 90 hours of the couch, they got me out on the roof over the porch washing windows. I was insane. That was rehab. It was a rehab. No,
Joe Van Wie 2:20:28
but I'm saying that was rehab in the 60s in Staten Island. There was no such
Tee Martin 2:20:32
thing. It was sitting on stuff. It was encounter therapy constantly. Yeah, it was filiation humiliation. It was behavior modification. We were all criminals are gonna reform us. Guys were in signs, fellas. tormenta is with us your age. shaved heads were in diapers with signs. Don't talk to me. I'm still big.
Joe Van Wie 2:21:00
Yeah, they must have read Hawthorn. Women with shaved this will work put a scarlet letter on
Tee Martin 2:21:05
men and women with shaved heads Say cheese because it was called sad. You know, fellas, there was only one thing I liked. was Saturday night. I had that greatest collection of jazz. And r&b you could imagine. Well, every time I tried to listen to it, go in that room myself during the day and listen to it. Somebody come and accuse me of isolating.
Joe Van Wie 2:21:32
Yeah, that sounds intense. It sounds psychotic, psychotic and
Tee Martin 2:21:37
cold, like do marathon encounters in the garage, just the men. And bank robbers would be cowering in the corner and tears are broken down in tears. That would not. There's more than some other time.
Joe Van Wie 2:21:58
I'm going to pause this right there. That was part one of T story. He's going to come back. Because there's a lot more I'd like to discuss and what happened to tea after a visit to the halfway house and how his recovery has progressed in 36 years. And what that looks like for someone to go through all the stages and trials live for 36 years without finding it necessary to drink or to use drugs. Or that it's ever safe for you to do that again. And it's really just confronting the pains and pleasures of life equally without running. I'd like to thank you for listening to another episode of all better. Find us on all better.fm or listen to us on Apple podcasts. Spotify, Google podcasts, Stitcher, I Heart Radio and Alexa. Special thanks to our producer John Edwards, an engineering company 570. Drone. Please like or subscribe to us on YouTube, Facebook, Instagram or Twitter. And if you're not on social media, you're awesome. Looking forward to seeing you again. And remember, just because you're sober doesn't mean you're right
Transcribed by https://otter.ai